Aftermarket speakers for H/K plus stock system

[PHZ]

Let the debates continue....

I'd like to change some of the speakers in my Car. Navigation, Harmon/Kardon. Want to keep stock head unit and most likely amp.

What speakers, other than BSW, will work for the size, fitting, and existing amp/unit for my car? I do not want to hack up the interior panels. I do not want to see anything other than stock aesthetics.

I have read very mixed reviews on replacing door speakers with BSW... and am just curious if there are other speaker upgrades [not the entire system] that would have the biggest impact on the sound.

thank you

[UdubBadger]

Personally I'd say swap the amp before anything. Speakers are only as good as the sound you are sending them so if you start with the junk the stock HK amp sends it, nothing will be enough of an improvement.

FWIW I noticed the Dynavin cleans up the sound a little bit when used with the stock stereo.

[PHZ]

thanx Badger

if i can only upgrade one... many say replace the speakers and the amp is ok....

Dynavin looks great, but its my entire upgrade budget :(

[cakM3]

I tend to agree with Seth regarding replacing the amplifier but seeing that you have a car that's 8 years going old, I would go with replacing the speakers first. A very good quality amp will make a big difference on the quality of the sound going to your speakers and you will have improved sound but as speakers get old and if you tend to jam on your stereo system like I do, they will get weaker and eventually tear requiring replacement. In my ///M, I have already replaced my door tweeters because the original speakers have torn....

As for myself, after doing all my performance mods.... I plan to replace my speakers using BSWs offerings since they are direct plug and play. I think Kyle (static667) could probably provide some recommendations regarding stereo equipment. I got to listen to Kyle's stereo setup and it was very nice...

[ryankokesh]

I too would be very interested to know what speakers (besides bsw) will fit without any modification. For some reason they seem to be incredibly elusive....


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[derbo]

have you tried http://www.bavariansoundwerks.com/ ???

edit: fail. didnt read.

[UdubBadger]

Rainbows and focals are usually on the list for bmw speaker fit


- Goin' H.A.M. Mobile

[Oli77]

Personally I'd say swap the amp before anything. Speakers are only as good as the sound you are sending them so if you start with the junk the stock HK amp sends it, nothing will be enough of an improvement.

Junk? I respectfully disagree.

You can tell the BMW engineered made sure the signal going to each speaker was bandpassed correctly and neatly, that the output was matches rather perfectly to each speaker. The sound in my non-HK car is far superior than in any other car I have owned. The 10 speakers are well tuned to the size of the car and the final product is very good to me.

Now, perhaps because I listen to Pink Floyd a lot, this means I stand clear of subs and don't like distortions much. However, IF one of my speaker blows, scratches or burns, I will simply replace IT. Not the amp.

About OP's original question, where do you get a speaker with the right impedance and size to replace our speakers?

http://www.madisound.com/manufacturers/audax/index.php?gclid=CNy3tpfln6cCFVBe2god6mqmeg
http://www.bmwgm5.com/Stereo_Frnt_Left.htm
http://www.onlinecarstereo.com/CarAudio/p_18364_Infinity_Reference_6022si.aspx
http://www.techronics.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=product.display&product_id=8216&aff=70877&gclid=CKHU5Nv4_6ECFRRM5QodeFa5GA

Many more out there.

[UdubBadger]

How can you disagree when you aren't subjected to it daily? It's a very muddy system and countless indicators point directly at the amp for being at fault.

Don't not knock it till you try it.


- Goin' H.A.M. Mobile

[Oli77]

So wait, the HK system isn't supposed to be superior to the non-HK system?

You are telling me the HK system is worse than the nonHK? I didn't know that.

[ryankokesh]

How can you disagree when you aren't subjected to it daily? It's a very muddy system and countless indicators point directly at the amp for being at fault.

Don't not knock it till you try it.


- Goin' H.A.M. Mobile

I'm not an audiophile by nearly any standard, but I feel like I know a bit more than the avg joe. Point is I don't think the h/k sounds that bad. Especially when you consider it's almost ten years old. I'd be interested to hear it with an upgraded amp though. Through one on Seth and I'll do a qualitative analysis and report back :)


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[ryankokesh]

And thanks for all the references!


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[UdubBadger]

So wait, the HK system isn't supposed to be superior to the non-HK system?

You are telling me the HK system is worse than the nonHK? I didn't know that.

Why is this now a discussion of hk vs non hk?

I never commented on the non hk, that was where you came in and said you disagree based on the performance of the non hk.

So why are we comparing apples to oranges? You assume the hk is up to a certain standard or level.

In my opinion it's not and I've been in other non hk systems in e46s and think they're a little sub par also, however I know it wasn't a $700 option so it's somewhat expected.

But BMW is notorious for over mudding their systems which is why bsw even exists.

The stock system in my e90 was better than this hk but still muddy. I've owned hondas with cleaner sounding stereos.

All is just IMO of course. I like my music though and I listen to everything so the stereo gets put through its paces.


- Goin' H.A.M. Mobile

[danewilson77]

Opinions and respectful chat are always welcome. Keep it up fellas.

Sent from Williamsburg, VA USA

[Hornung418]

E46 BMW Professional head unit cleans a lot of the garbage processed by the Business Head unit. Import it from Europe for <$450. Aggie had it on his '03 330ci w/ HK system. He's selling his Head Unit on e46fanatics.

Other than that, I don't know jack. I turn up my stereo by rolling the windows down ;)

Horney...via TT.

[PHZ]

Uhm.. Yeah....

My question was what speakers would work WITH the HK/NAV system in my car....

Though interesting, I'd like to try to steer this back on topic if possible :)

[Hornung418]

Crutchfield has some good speakers. Basically, any speaker will do fine as long as it's not paper. This is where BSW succeeds and is in business.

[BimmerWill]

Crutchfield has some good speakers. Basically, any speaker will do fine as long as it's not paper. This is where BSW succeeds and is in business.

+1 on crutchfield I've dealt with them in the past. Excellent products and customer service that can't be beat.

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[PHZ]

Crutchfield has some good speakers. Basically, any speaker will do fine as long as it's not paper. This is where BSW succeeds and is in business.

Any speaker? I thought most were too big for our doors?
Will any speaker work with existing amp?

[WOLFN8TR]

Any speaker? I thought most were too big for our doors?
Will any speaker work with existing amp?

The biggest problem is the mounting depth of those subs. I can't remember the exact depth but they are shallow depth speakers. I found a pair on Crutchfield's website a year ago and I believe they were Kenwoods but not positive.

[Oli77]

Apologies for muddying the waters with the HK non-HK discussion (didn't catch the subtlety in the thread title).

I still think there are places where you can find speakers out there (crutchfield is a good start). Like I said, match the ohms and the physical size and you are golden.

http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/category/580/Speakers/1.html
http://www.alpine-usa.com/product/view/sps-410

Sorry Seth, but I still gently disagree and with the utmost respect, when you claim the head unit in our cars is "junk".

[ryankokesh]

The configuratiors on crutchfield et al never serve up any results for our cars. What's the depth we're goin for on that sub?


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[ryankokesh]

Actually, I just checked Evernote and found my notes on the subject from a while back based on what I dug up about what others have done. Can anyone verify I'm correct with these measurements?

FRONT TWEETER
- 8 ohms
- 1" diameter, could be cut to 1.25" max
- 0.50" deep

Upgraded to:
- Audax
- 8 ohm

FRONT MIDRANGE
- 8 ohm
- 2.75" diameter
- 1.25" deep

Upgraded to:
- found to be comparable to Peerless

FRONT BASS
- 2 ohms (3 with h/k)
- 6.25" diameter
- 2.75" deep

upgraded to:
- goldwood
- 4 ohm

OR

- vifa
- 4 ohm
- midbass

REAR DECK
- 2 ohms (3 with h/k)
- 6.25" diameter
- 2.75" deep (3" hard depth)


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[Oli77]

Thought the midrange was 2.5" and 4 ohms for HK setup and tweeters 0.75" 3 ohms for HK setup.
Don't know about depth.

[ryankokesh]

:dunno


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[Oli77]

Nope, you are right according to BSW the tweeters are 25 mm = 0.98 ".
Midrange are 2.5"
and mid bass (rear deck) are 6.25"
Don't you love it when we write inches with decimals?

[PHZ]

I found this. Seems quite helpful.

http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/showthread.php?t=301506&highlight=ewc

[Oli77]

Indeed. But it's the BSW way. Probably hassle-free though and more expensive now compared to 2008 prices.

[PHZ]

yes. im beginning to think its the only easy way

[johnrando]

I did a search for my vert and nothing came up that didn't require a lot of work, so I'll probably just upgrade the fronts with BSW.

BTW, I used to think the HK system was OK, until I heard Kyle's sound. OMG! That setup is amazing. Puts the HK to shame. Now I know why people think HK is trash. Probably, for the time, it was fine, and it's still fine today depending on your expectations. I'm comfortable with my HK setup, but will probably upgrade when cash flow permits. But in comparison to what you can do today, the HK systems is like kiddie toys vs. the real deal.

[Jon D]

I did a search for my vert and nothing came up that didn't require a lot of work, so I'll probably just upgrade the fronts with BSW.

BTW, I used to think the HK system was OK, until I heard Kyle's sound. OMG! That setup is amazing. Puts the HK to shame. Now I know why people think HK is trash. Probably, for the time, it was fine, and it's still fine today depending on your expectations. I'm comfortable with my HK setup, but will probably upgrade when cash flow permits. But in comparison to what you can do today, the HK systems is like kiddie toys vs. the real deal.

You now have an idea ... I could not believe what rip and replace sounded like till I did it..

[WOLFN8TR]

Back in the day I had a few thousand into my stereo, even did stereo completions for fun. Now as long as it plays decent music I'm good. Weird how you out grow things.

[johnrando]

You now have an idea ... I could not believe what rip and replace sounded like till I did it..

How much work was it just replacing your fronts (both sets)?

[Jon D]

How much work was it just replacing your fronts (both sets)?

no idea for that alone .. paid someone to redo whole system at once. But speakers were sized so they fit existing space. Not sized to work with HK amp etc. BSW is the best drop in solution. I costed it out including the sub and decided for just a little more get a whole lot more.

[Go Horns!]

Because the H/K system uses a bunch of weird impedances for the speakers, you are just better off getting the BSW stage 1 if the only thing you ever plan to do is the speakers. It is $600 for 10 component speakers, so you can't compare it to going to best buy and picking up two pairs of co-axial speakers. You are getting a product specifically designed for a very unique amplifier.

If you are going to change the amp out, then you might as well get the new amp and then just get speakers that fit the openings. 6.5 mids with 2.5 depth, and 1-inch tweeters; forget the mid-range, you won't need it if you replace the amp.

You should try to find someone with BSW stage 1 and listen to it to see if it is the fix you are looking for.

I went with a complete change of head-unit, amp, speakers, and added a sub. Best mod so far. I routinely drive for 4 to 5 hours and having a great stereo makes a huge difference.