Survey Says: Get the Royal Purple out of Your Diff

[kayger12]

Got my Blackstone report back on my 16k mile differential sample using Royal Purple Max Gear.

All I can say is, I'm glad that Derek mentioned his sister's diff failure after switching to RP and also posted up some links pointing to suspect performance of RP in the diff.

As you can see from the report below, my metal numbers were through the roof. And while Blackstone wasn't alarmist over the numbers, I think there is major reason for concern with those kind of numbers.

Fortunately, the RP Synchromax in my Getrag performed much better. I'll post that info up in a separate thread.

http://i1234.photobucket.com/albums/ff401/Kayger12/DiffSample_edited-1.jpg

[danewilson77]

Interesting. Glad I'm running Redline.

HTC Thunderbolt+TT

[kayger12]

Interesting. Glad I'm running Redline.

HTC Thunderbolt+TT

Yeah, glad I had that plan of changing out at 15k. Also thankful for Derek's timing that kicked me in the ass to do it.

At least we have solid data now.

[danewilson77]

Yeah, glad I had that plan of changing out at 15k. Also thankful for Derek's timing that kicked me in the ass to do it.

At least we have solid data now.

Most def. Thanks.

HTC Thunderbolt+TT

[johnrando]

Thanks for closing that loop Keith. Good to know.

[kayger12]

My pleasure... or displeasure, lol.

[kayger12]

Interesting statement made in reference to these results posted by a member over at BITOG:



Not much knowledge on gear oil from me, but my conclusion is that you did right by switching to Red Line.

RP could have washed out wear metals that were left behind by the original fill. Synthetic oil can do that in an engine, and it might do it in a rear end.

[Johnmadd]

Sooo, im running rp in the transmission, should I be worried?

[kayger12]

Sooo, im running rp in the transmission, should I be worried?

My trans report with the Synchromax was actually good.

Sent from my outdated Droid X

[Johnmadd]

My trans report with the Synchromax was actually good.

Sent from my outdated Droid X

Ok, gtk.

[kayger12]

Interestingly, I'm getting feedback on BITOG that high metal content after the drain of a first fluid change is not necessarily out of the ordinary.

I'll keep this updated as info comes in.


Sent from my outdated Droid X

[nike001]

How can a fluid possibly be this bad without them noticing or doing something about it? I'd think that this should be taken of the shelves..

[kayger12]

^ Yeah, but the only problem with me assigning blame to the RP is that as some on BITOG pointed out, the RP stayed in grade and generally held up well according to the report.

It's not like the RP had broken down and was no longer lubricating.

The real question is-- are the metals left over from the previous run? If that were the case, it would be more of an indication that there was a problem with the factory gear oil that was in there for the first 47k.

From the feedback I'm getting on BITOG, this is a legitimate possibility.

[danewilson77]

Or... Maybe those wear products are normal for 60k mile diff?

HTC Thunderbolt+TT

[shanneba]

700+ iron is way more than I have seen in my OUAs!

I have three diff UOAs from my 2003 330Ci. Factory fill, Motul Gear 300 and Red Line 75w-90NS with the Quaife LSD. The gears are the original 3.38 gears on the Quaife LSD unit.
The factory fill was changed at about 38,000 miles and had much lower iron and chromium numbers.

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1758693



Make / Model 2003 BMW 330Ci
engine M54
diff type open open Quaife
Total miles 38,000 53,400 81,000
Brand Castrol? Motul Red Line
Weight 75w-90 75w-90 75w-90 NS
miles on sample 38,000 15,400 27,600
#changes factory fill 2nd change
type SAF-XO?? Gear 300
date 8/5/2006 5/28/2008 01/15/2010

Aluminum 0 1 2
chrom 1 2 2
iron 240 197 190
copper 2 1 1
lead 0 0 1
tin 3 0 0
moly 0 0 0
nickel 0 0 1
manganese 10 6 6
silver 0 0 0
titanium 0 0 0
potassium 1 1 4
boron 216 441 226
silicon 7 19 82
sodium 4 3 10
calcium 7 14 14
magnesium 3 1024 14
phosphorus 1452 1587 1939
zinc 6 6 10
barium 3 0 30

viscosity SUS @ 212 F 74.5 71.1 72.0
viscosity cSt @100C 14.12 13.23 13.47
flashpoint*f 410 395 415
water % 0 0 0
insolubles % 0.1 0.3 0.3

[kayger12]

Or... Maybe those wear products are normal for 60k mile diff?

HTC Thunderbolt+TT

I don't think so. I mean, the universal averages should show what normal wear is.

Ultimately, I don't know what to think. Bottom line is, I don't think I'll ever know as I won't go back to RP for the diff, and any future tests won't tell us much as they will be different fluid-- and if it was previous wear metal, it's now flushed and won't be back...

[mLuMaN83]

Running Synchromax!

[kayger12]

^ No worries there. The Synchromax performed well in the trans.

For anyone interested in following the BITOG discussion on this sample, link here: http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2589995#Post2589995

[LivesNearCostco]

Just got a Blackstone report after running RP Synchromax in my 6-speed for 15,000 miles. Looks good; could have run it longer. However the sample was from the 3rd fill of the tranny (assuming the 4 previous owners never changed the tranny fluid) so any extra wear metals from the original extended use were probably long gone.
First fill: OEM
Second fill: RP Synchromax
Third fill: RP Synchromax (sample from this fill)
Fourth fill: Redline MTL (plan to sample in 30,000 miles)

I have drained the diff twice but never collected a sample from it.

4416

[kayger12]

Looks good.

My trans numbers with the RP were good as well.

I'd go back to Synchromax in the trans with no worries.

Sticking with Red Line for the diff though.

I wish this was sent with a Galaxy S3

[terraphantm]

My trans report with the Synchromax was actually good.

Sent from my outdated Droid X

I still don't trust it after my personal experience. The shifting became a lot notchier than before the change after just 10k(ish) miles of RP. I drained it at 20k and I had an alarming number of brass shavings in the fluid. I just can't trust it after that.

[kayger12]

I still don't trust it after my personal experience. The shifting became a lot notchier than before the change after just 10k(ish) miles of RP. I drained it at 20k and I had an alarming number of brass shavings in the fluid. I just can't trust it after that.

I don't blame you. Mine was starting to get notchy right before I changed it out.

Ultimately it was in for 15k and had a great Blackstone and no shavings.

Your experience was the primary reason that I only ran it 15 and then sent it for analysis.

I wish this was sent with a Galaxy S3

[LivesNearCostco]

I didn't have any brass shavings but yes I think my transmission did start to feel a little notchier after 10,000 miles on the RP Synchromax. Going to Redline MTL didn't make it significantly better overall. I think now it feels smoother than the old Royal Purple when things are warm but notchier than old RP when things are cold.