She's been violated in a most terrible way...

[SoarinZHP]

I don't know what just came over me...

http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa475/mrkrisb/4e6d14b7.jpg

[Hermes]

Hahaha... win

[mimalmo]

one wheel wonder

[M0nk3y]

Looks like you did that with a motorcycle...lol

[SoarinZHP]

one wheel wonder

Too bad BMW thinks we are not worthy things like LSD's.

[Hermes]

Too bad BMW thinks we are not worthy things like LSD's.

IIRC the LSD from the M3 is about $1800

[Meric]

Looks like a crime scene to me.. Beatifull imola red got raped.

[SoarinZHP]

Still have the burned rubber smell in the garage. Yuk.

[M0nk3y]

IIRC the LSD from the M3 is about $1800

So worth it :)

[az3579]

That's not rape...


... getting the windows smashed in while a thief attempts to steal it, then realizing that he can't because the electronics are too complicated, rummaging around the interior for something valuable to steal and leaving everything destroyed and a mess...

THAT'S rapage. What you did is nothing more than (fun) tomfoolery. :biggrin

[Hornung418]

So worth it :)
Not with a 6.8k red line :(

I'm gonna have a 3.38 built with an LSD.

[Katu]

Not with a 6.8k red line :(

I'm gonna have a 3.38 built with an LSD.

What does that run?

[bullfrogs_M3]

IIRC the LSD from the M3 is about $1800

or $500 from a local member :evil grin Still sitting in the garage just waiting on a few more parts before an install

[Hornung418]

More expensive than an ///M3 rear end, but the taller diff is more functional with our lower red lines.

[Katu]

I thought the Quaife diffs were only around $1300? Am I wrong?

[MsRN]

More expensive than an ///M3 rear end, but the taller diff is more functional with our lower red lines.

How so? It lets you accelerate more quickly at the expense of top end, right? I'd assume the S54 still has the upper hand, no?

[Hornung418]

I thought the Quaife diffs were only around $1300? Am I wrong?

Is that installed? If so...I'd be all over that!


How so? It lets you accelerate more quickly at the expense of top end, right? I'd assume the S54 still has the upper hand, no?

If you're making 350wheel on an F/I M54B30 you're still limited to the 7000rpm. The S54 has an 8000rpm limit which can make an extra 20 mph in 3rd gear, where the 330 would have to shift out of the power band. Just my train of thought on that. the 3.62 LSD has worked out for a few people in Non-Ms but it's not for me personally. But it will work should you go that route. I thought about this for over a year.

[M0nk3y]

How so? It lets you accelerate more quickly at the expense of top end, right? I'd assume the S54 still has the upper hand, no?

Correct.

You take advantage of higher gearing with a lower HP car, you will accelerate more quickly.

You will lose top-end, but IMO it's worth it.

The S54 will still win, obviously...but you'll crush similar cars

My gearing, in 2nd I bounce the rev at 65 MPH. If you put my gearing in your car, you will be around 55...IIRC

[Hornung418]

Correct.

You take advantage of higher gearing with a lower HP car, you will accelerate more quickly.

You will lose top-end, but IMO it's worth it.

The S54 will still win, obviously...but you'll crush similar cars

My gearing, in 2nd I bounce the rev at 65 MPH. If you put my gearing in your car, you will be around 55...IIRC
Yes the gearing is about the same in the M3 and the stock ZHP. Throw a 3.62 LSD in there you'll be at 56mph in 2nd gear and not even 85 in 3rd...you should be able to hit 102 in 3rd gear with the 3.07 and a 7000rpm red line...which is pretty incredible on the track.

Michele, your car is S/C'd so I wouldn't worry about doing the M3 rear end swap, just build the 3.07 or get a 3.38 or 3.46 built into an LSD.
Assuming you have a 7000rpm red line with the S/C software and 255/35ZR18s out back:

With the 3.07 LSD, speed in 3rd is theoretically 102.27 mph - Cruising at 74mph (9mph over 65 mph speed limits) is at 2593 rpm.
With the 3.38 LSD, speed in 3rd is theoretically 92.89 mph - Cruising at 74mph (9mph over 65 mph speed limits) is at 2855 rpm.
With the 3.46 LSD, speed in 3rd is theoretically 90.74 mph - Cruising at 74mph (9mph over 65 mph speed limits) is at 2923 rpm.
With the 3.62 LSD, speed in 3rd is theoretically 86.73 mph - Cruising at 74mph (9mph over 65 mph speed limits) is at 3058 rpm.

Sorry...I am quite bored with this English paper LOL...Hope these calculations can be of help.

http://www.bokchoys.com/differential/e46_gear_ratio_calculator.htm

[L0veZHP]

Umm Beautiful PIC btW LOVING IT! Nice Imola too :waldo

[Whitexi]

Yes the gearing is about the same in the M3 and the stock ZHP. Throw a 3.62 LSD in there you'll be at 56mph in 2nd gear and not even 85 in 3rd...you should be able to hit 102 in 3rd gear with the 3.07 and a 7000rpm red line...which is pretty incredible on the track.

Michele, your car is S/C'd so I wouldn't worry about doing the M3 rear end swap, just build the 3.07 or get a 3.38 or 3.46 built into an LSD.
Assuming you have a 7000rpm red line with the S/C software and 255/35ZR18s out back:

With the 3.07 LSD, speed in 3rd is theoretically 102.27 mph - Cruising at 74mph (9mph over 65 mph speed limits) is at 2593 rpm.
With the 3.38 LSD, speed in 3rd is theoretically 92.89 mph - Cruising at 74mph (9mph over 65 mph speed limits) is at 2855 rpm.
With the 3.46 LSD, speed in 3rd is theoretically 90.74 mph - Cruising at 74mph (9mph over 65 mph speed limits) is at 2923 rpm.
With the 3.62 LSD, speed in 3rd is theoretically 86.73 mph - Cruising at 74mph (9mph over 65 mph speed limits) is at 3058 rpm.

Sorry...I am quite bored with this English paper LOL...Hope these calculations can be of help.

http://www.bokchoys.com/differential/e46_gear_ratio_calculator.htm

It mind bottling how much info you know lol.

I have done doughnuts before but I require snow for mine to accomplish them! That's a cool pic though.

[az3579]

I thought the Quaife diffs were only around $1300? Am I wrong?

Nope. Try closer to $3-5k.


Sent from my iPhone 4S from Tapatalk

[johnrando]

Yes the gearing is about the same in the M3 and the stock ZHP. Throw a 3.62 LSD in there you'll be at 56mph in 2nd gear and not even 85 in 3rd...you should be able to hit 102 in 3rd gear with the 3.07 and a 7000rpm red line...which is pretty incredible on the track.

Michele, your car is S/C'd so I wouldn't worry about doing the M3 rear end swap, just build the 3.07 or get a 3.38 or 3.46 built into an LSD.
Assuming you have a 7000rpm red line with the S/C software and 255/35ZR18s out back:

With the 3.07 LSD, speed in 3rd is theoretically 102.27 mph - Cruising at 74mph (9mph over 65 mph speed limits) is at 2593 rpm.
With the 3.38 LSD, speed in 3rd is theoretically 92.89 mph - Cruising at 74mph (9mph over 65 mph speed limits) is at 2855 rpm.
With the 3.46 LSD, speed in 3rd is theoretically 90.74 mph - Cruising at 74mph (9mph over 65 mph speed limits) is at 2923 rpm.
With the 3.62 LSD, speed in 3rd is theoretically 86.73 mph - Cruising at 74mph (9mph over 65 mph speed limits) is at 3058 rpm.

Sorry...I am quite bored with this English paper LOL...Hope these calculations can be of help.

http://www.bokchoys.com/differential/e46_gear_ratio_calculator.htm

Good info, thanks for posting.

[Katu]

Nope. Try closer to $3-5k.

Oh snap, my bad!

I know there are different types of LSD, each with their advantages and disadvantages.. but it sounds like even with all the extra parts involved with the M3 diff swap, that is still the cheapest option?

Maybe I should just get a 3.46 or 3.38 open diff and save a bunch of money.

[Hornung418]

While the 3.62 is the cheapest...It's not the ideal swap.

BMW LSDs are also on the weak side...not a lot of lock up. Aftermarket is definitely the way to go if you want the best setup in a Non-M.

[Hochspannung]

I want an LSD more than anything. 4k is a huge amount of money for two wheel peel though.

[Katu]

I had no idea the m3 diff was 3.62, that seems like a bit much even with a 6 speed.

[Hornung418]

I had no idea the m3 diff was 3.62, that seems like a bit much even with a 6 speed.
Yes...quite the jump in ratio...If you had an automatic, it wouldn't be that bad, I might add, but you would have to address the drive shaft as they are completely different in terms of length and flange shape.

[M0nk3y]

I had no idea the m3 diff was 3.62, that seems like a bit much even with a 6 speed.

1st gear is really short...and stupid short.

[BRGcoopahS]

Too bad BMW thinks we are not worthy things like LSD's.

What's funny is my mini has a factory LSD. Apparently BMW thought a fwd hatchback should have one over their own best selling model. Go figure

[Sockethead]

Horney, Are talking about swapping the M3 center section complete? I thought that wasn't possible due to different mounting bolt pattern...

[Hornung418]

Horney, Are talking about swapping the M3 center section complete? I thought that wasn't possible due to different mounting bolt pattern...
Can you rephrase that? Not sure what you mean.

[Sockethead]

Can you rephrase that? Not sure what you mean.

Are talking about swapping out the whole pumpkin (old school term) or taking out the gears and installing just the differential unit.
I've heard of people swapping the whole subframe as well...

[Hornung418]

Are talking about swapping out the whole pumpkin (old school term) or taking out the gears and installing just the differential unit.
I've heard of people swapping the whole subframe as well...

Swapping the subframe is the only way to do it.

Courtesy of Gingerbread...

[Sockethead]

Good to know... that's what I was thinking

[mimalmo]

You will need to swap the diff, subframe, brace and driveshaft from a manual trans M3.

[gr330zhp]

This thread makes me realize how much I want an M3. :facepalm LSD and the S54 especially! Drove an M3 last week and remembered how much I loved that powerplant.

[Newjack]

This thread makes me realize how much I want an M3. :facepalm LSD and the S54 especially! Drove an M3 last week and remembered how much I loved that powerplant.

Power is a great thing. But go ahead and take a right hand turn at 30mph and watch your car rip through it as if the car were on rails. After that, power isn't as enticing. :thumbsup

[gr330zhp]

LSD helps that :)

[Newjack]

LSD helps that :)

Yes I know... :(

[M0nk3y]

Transferring from a Open Diff to a LSD + 150HP is a big difference.

I never knew you could actually put power in a turn...thrilling...lol

(This also explains why I lost control multiple times this year auto-xing (Minor throttle control FTL))

[gr330zhp]

The feeling of that setup E46 M3/M Coupe is just great! Great overall cars!

[Sockethead]

When I was at Beaver Run last year, turning through the last turn, the inside wheel would lift and loose traction.... it sucked.

[M0nk3y]

When I was at Beaver Run last year, turning through the last turn, the inside wheel would lift and loose traction.... it sucked.

Wait, you're lifting rear wheels?

You sure you weren't driving a Civic? lol.

But seriously, BMWs don't lift rear wheels...it's just the fact that the diff is an open diff, and well there is your problem.

[Hornung418]

Yeah...inside front is the one to lift...what's the last turn at Beaver Run like? Off-camber?

Courtesy of Gingerbread...

[az3579]

Wait, you're lifting rear wheels?

You sure you weren't driving a Civic? lol.

But seriously, BMWs don't lift rear wheels...it's just the fact that the diff is an open diff, and well there is your problem.

Oh they sure do, depending on the mods. I've seen an E36 lift a rear wheel at an SCCA National Tour event a couple of years ago.


Sent from my iPhone 4S from Tapatalk

[Sockethead]

Ok, well it came unweighted enough for it to loose traction... the turn is slightly off camber I believe and pretty tight. With more suspension work, I'm sure the car would be a little more centered but ultimately it needs LSD... it doesn't have a ton of power but it still needs it..

[MrMaico]

What's funny is my mini has a factory LSD. Apparently BMW thought a fwd hatchback should have one over their own best selling model. Go figure

You'd have to think that's mainly to help deal with the torque-steer of the FWD.

Unless you're tracking it, I don't really see a need for an LSD on our cars. With the proper tires our 235 HP cars don't have the power to take advantage of an LSD. Now if you drive in snow alot, then they help and can be LOTS of fun! I have yet to break an inside wheel loose even on tight corners and believe me, I've tried.:biggrin

[BRGcoopahS]

You'd have to think that's mainly to help deal with the torque-steer of the FWD.

Now if you drive in snow alot, then they help and can be LOTS of fun!

I have yet to get stuck in the snow, even with crappy all seasons. The LSD definitely helps. It makes driving in the snow way more fun (for about 10 minutes and then I realize how much I hate the snow/winter)

[Stu]

Looks like the way I took turns on the way to get my new tires mounted :rofl