Is an e90 330i Sport better than a e46 330i ZHP?

[MPowerFanatic]

I have been searching for the right BMW as my daily driver and recently focused on ZHP cars. However, I decided to bump my spending cap to $20k, which allows me to also buy e46 M3's with moderate miles and higher mileage e90 330i Sports.

How do you guys compare the e90 cars to your e46's overall (performance, amenities, quality and most of all fun to drive)? I know there will be some biases, but it would be great to get feedback from guys who have driven both. Obviously, the e90 cars have improved to stay ahead of the competition. Looks are a personal opinion and I find both generations very attractive designs. However, the quality and materials used in the e90 interiors appear to be significantly improved. Is this true?

I have not spent much time in e46 cars, except for a couple brief moments recently. However, I have spent a fair amount of time looking at e90 M3's including ZCP models when I was in the market for one, but purchased something different. I thought the interior quality was quite nice and a significant improvement over the e46 M3 from memory. What are your thoughts?

Which is the better overall daily driver sport sedan?

[Audi 0000]

The less money you spend on the car- the more money you have for the mods.:biggrin

[M0nk3y]

This is my opinion. I've driven both.

The E46 is the last 3 Series that will ever have any sense of feel when you drive it. The feeling I'm talking about is the sense of when you turn the wheels, you're directly connected to the tires.

The E90 is dumb'ed down with electronic assist steering..etc, and you completely lose the feel from the steering wheel. There is a ton of play in the wheel before you actually feel something, and IMO the cabin interior layout wants me to throw up. I like it simple. Pressing "audio" to open up a variety of options to access AUX and CD annoys me. I just want to press mode once and get there.

In the end, I think the E90 was marketed for the older crowd who doesn't appreciate the backroads from time to time. That's just me and you can take it with a grain of salt

[danewilson77]

^I like this opinion.

HTC Thunderbolt+TT

[bcleaver]

This is my opinion. I've driven both.

The E46 is the last 3 Series that will ever have any sense of feel when you drive it. The feeling I'm talking about is the sense of when you turn the wheels, you're directly connected to the tires.

That's funny, I probably would have said the same thing about the E36 compared to E46. But having driven an E90 I also would agree with you as well. It does feel a lot more disconnected.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

And I've owned an E90 and E92. The E46 was better in every department to me.

The interior of the E9X blew. Totally cheap to me. Didn't feel as intuitive and it seemed sterile. No soul is the way I would describe it.

I've only owned one E46 but it's the best BMW I've owned (I'm on my 7th). Other BMWs had some cool things but none of them ever measured up to my zhp.

The zhp is an all around thing of beauty. Sum of the parts, baby. It just works. Period.


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- Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[gr330zhp]

And I've owned an E90 and E92. The E46 was better in every department to me.

The interior of the E9X blew. Totally cheap to me. Didn't feel as intuitive and it seemed sterile. No soul is the way I would describe it.

I've only owned one E46 but it's the best BMW I've owned (I'm on my 7th). Other BMWs had some cool things but none of them ever measured up to my zhp.

The zhp is an all around thing of beauty. Sum of the parts, baby. It just works. Period.


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- Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I like this response.

I have put about 45k on my zhp, ib
almost.traded my zhp for an e90, i have driven my sisters E92 a bunch, and everytime i get back into my 330i it just feels perfect, from the drive, size and interior, its all perfect imo

Sent from my HTC Desire, Like a BOSS!

[kayger12]

This is my opinion. I've driven both.

The E46 is the last 3 Series that will ever have any sense of feel when you drive it. The feeling I'm talking about is the sense of when you turn the wheels, you're directly connected to the tires.

The E90 is dumb'ed down with electronic assist steering..etc, and you completely lose the feel from the steering wheel. There is a ton of play in the wheel before you actually feel something, and IMO the cabin interior layout wants me to throw up. I like it simple. Pressing "audio" to open up a variety of options to access AUX and CD annoys me. I just want to press mode once and get there.

In the end, I think the E90 was marketed for the older crowd who doesn't appreciate the backroads from time to time. That's just me and you can take it with a grain of salt

Well said.

Droid X. Tapatalk. Use it.

[webster]

Depends what you're looking for. if it's fun to drive factor, the E90 ain't even close to the zhp.

[rikdee]

For us DIYer's, the E9x is much more difficult to work on. Full under-pans, crazy electronics, no engine block drain plug, no diff drain plug, etc. These cars were designed for dealer service and as such, owning one out of warranty is risky.

[M0nk3y]

That's funny, I probably would have said the same thing about the E36 compared to E46. But having driven an E90 I also would agree with you as well. It does feel a lot more disconnected.

Driving my E86, compared to the E46, id say the e46 is like the e90 in this case....but its a completely different car for a completely different purpose

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[MPowerFanatic]

I didn't realize that the 3 series took that much of a turn towards Lexus transitioning from the e46 to e90, but I believe it. In my brief drives in the e90 M3's and ZCP's I thought they handled fairly tautly and had good power. But you can only get so much from test drives.

This reminds me when I first sold my e39 M5 in 2006 to purchase a new e60 M5. I thought the e60 interior looked terrible and hated Idrive. Actually, I still hate Idrive. However, I soon got accustomed to the e60's interior design and appreciated the light year improvement in quality and amenities. However, I did feel the handling and the SMG made the e60 M5 feel less fun to drive and disconnected to my e39's of the past. I sold it within a year and was back into another e39. Funny thing was when I was driving home in another e39 m5 I noticed the seats felt like wood, power was missing, V10 howl gone and needed glasses seeing the low res Nav. I guess I must be getting old, because the e39 just felt old and dated. I bought another e60 again within 6 months and never returned to a e39.

Do you guys think the e46 to e90 changes are similar to what I experienced from e39 to e60? However, this time around I want the more entertaining and fun to drive sedan first and foremost. I am not concerned so much about amenities and comfort anymore.

[bake]

I didn't realize that the 3 series took that much of a turn towards Lexus transitioning from the e46 to e90, but I believe it. In my brief drives in the e90 M3's and ZCP's I thought they handled fairly tautly and had good power. But you can only get so much from test drives.

This reminds me when I first sold my e39 M5 in 2006 to purchase a new e60 M5. I thought the e60 interior looked terrible and hated Idrive. Actually, I still hate Idrive. However, I soon got accustomed to the e60's interior design and appreciated the light year improvement in quality and amenities. However, I did feel the handling and the SMG made the e60 M5 feel less fun to drive and disconnected to my e39's of the past. I sold it within a year and was back into another e39. Funny thing was when I was driving home in another e39 m5 I noticed the seats felt like wood, power was missing, V10 howl gone and needed glasses seeing the low res Nav. I guess I must be getting old, because the e39 just felt old and dated. I bought another e60 again within 6 months and never returned to a e39.

Do you guys think the e46 to e90 changes are similar to what I experienced from e39 to e60? However, this time around I want the more entertaining and fun to drive sedan first and foremost. I am not concerned so much about amenities and comfort anymore.

Selling two E39 M5's in the same lifetime should be a crime! :-)

[mikeyb74]

This is my opinion. I've driven both.

The E46 is the last 3 Series that will ever have any sense of feel when you drive it. The feeling I'm talking about is the sense of when you turn the wheels, you're directly connected to the tires.

The E90 is dumb'ed down with electronic assist steering..etc, and you completely lose the feel from the steering wheel. There is a ton of play in the wheel before you actually feel something, and IMO the cabin interior layout wants me to throw up. I like it simple. Pressing "audio" to open up a variety of options to access AUX and CD annoys me. I just want to press mode once and get there.

In the end, I think the E90 was marketed for the older crowd who doesn't appreciate the backroads from time to time. That's just me and you can take it with a grain of salt

Very well said!

[MPowerFanatic]

Selling two E39 M5's in the same lifetime should be a crime! :-)

I agree ;)

I would actually like to get another and was on the top of my list, but the fear of repairs precludes me from doing so. When I had the e39's they had the factory warranty or CPO. The first one had VANOS problems twice early on, which were fixed under warranty. However, I don't know the cost out of pocket, but I am sure it was not cheap. I just don't want to be nickled and dimed here and there, but in the M5's case, silver dollared here and there.

[mikeyb74]

e90s can be costly to maintain. $444.95 for a water pump and $119.95 for a thermostat. I'm all set.

[cakM3]

M0nk3y said it best about the E46. Marcus also mentioned that the newer 3 series lacks soul, I agree there as well. It comes down to preferences and everyone have their favorites. As for me, I'll stick to my ZHP and ///M :biggrin

[MPowerFanatic]

M0nk3y said it best about the E46. Marcus also mentioned that the newer 3 series lacks soul, I agree there as well. It comes down to preferences and everyone have their favorites. As for me, I'll stick to my ZHP and ///M :biggrin

Charlie,

You are actually the perfect person to ask about the e46 M3 and the ZHP. My seach was originally for an m3, but I was looking to spend only $15k, but have since raised it to $20k, so now decent M3's are within my reach. How do you compare them in regards to handling, braking and overall fun to drive quotient? On a scale of 1 to 10 and if the M3 were a 10 in acceleration and power delivery flexibility. How does the ZHP compare?

Thanks

[M0nk3y]

Charlie,

You are actually the perfect person to ask about the e46 M3 and the ZHP. My seach was originally for an m3, but I was looking to spend only $15k, but have since raised it to $20k, so now decent M3's are within my reach. How do you compare them in regards to handling, braking and overall fun to drive quotient? On a scale of 1 to 10 and if the M3 were a 10 in acceleration and power delivery flexibility. How does the ZHP compare?

Thanks

The M3 hands down will win the power and acceleration. Trust me. I've driven E46 330s, and E90/92 328i (similar HP and more torque). I've driven my those cars and they feel like a honda fit in terms of climbing first gear. If you want power...you need an M3

[MPowerFanatic]

How many here have driven both the e46 M3 and e39 M5's a fair amount? I probably know the e39 M5 better than 99% of BMW enthusiasts out there, but I have little seat time in the e46 M3.

How much more fun is the M3 to drive than the M5 taking all practicality issues out of the equation?




The M3 hands down will win the power and acceleration. Trust me. I've driven E46 330s, and E90/92 328i (similar HP and more torque). I've driven my those cars and they feel like a honda fit in terms of climbing first gear. If you want power...you need an M3

I don't doubt it for a moment. That extra 100hp is significant!

[cakM3]

Charlie,

You are actually the perfect person to ask about the e46 M3 and the ZHP. My seach was originally for an m3, but I was looking to spend only $15k, but have since raised it to $20k, so now decent M3's are within my reach. How do you compare them in regards to handling, braking and overall fun to drive quotient? On a scale of 1 to 10 and if the M3 were a 10 in acceleration and power delivery flexibility. How does the ZHP compare?

Thanks

When comparing a ZHP to an M3 I have to say that if you are looking for raw power then it's the M3 hands down. In my humble opinion, the M3 is the ultimate 3 series in every catagory except for comfort driving. The suspension is a lot more stiff than the suspension of the ZHP. Maintenance is another issue....you need deep pockets to keep the M in tip-top condition. I do lots of preventive maintenance on my M. To date I would say that I have already sunk in over $5k in maintenance and can say that it has been well worth it. My M runs just as good as it did when it was brand new and whenever I drive it I fall in love with it all over again...can't keep the smile off :biggrin

For daily driving duties, I prefer to drive my ZHP. It performs well above my expectation and I don't miss driving the M3 as much. It's fun factor is up there with the M3. Since I commute between 50-60 miles every work day and going over the Newport Bridge is like driving over cobblestone roads at 60mph, I prefer driving the ZHP. The ride is more forgiving over the ride in the M3 but the suspension is tight, not soft. I still feel the road but it's not as harsh like it is in my M3.

Now for the scale:
Comfort - 10 (still on OEM suspension @ 110k)
Acceleration - 8 (I have Afe CAI and Shark tuned)
Braking - 8 (I installed BMW performance rotors, ceramic pads, and stainless steel braided lines)
Fun to Drive - 10

One of the best things I enjoy about owning my ZHP is that it is not a "standard" 330i so it's more unique over the rest of the 3-series line with exception of being an M3. I love the fact that mine is Imola Red (BMW Motorsport reserved colors). Basically, the next best thing you can get. I hope this helps.

If you desire the ultimate coupe, don't mind the stiffer ride and want power then it's an obvious choice....get the M3 :biggrin Either way, I don't think you will regret your choice. I am lucky in that I have both:thumbsup

[MPowerFanatic]

When comparing a ZHP to an M3 I have to say that if you are looking for raw power then it's the M3 hands down. In my humble opinion, the M3 is the ultimate 3 series in every catagory except for comfort driving. The suspension is a lot more stiff than the suspension of the ZHP. Maintenance is another issue....you need deep pockets to keep the M in tip-top condition. I do lots of preventive maintenance on my M. To date I would say that I have already sunk in over $5k in maintenance and can say that it has been well worth it. My M runs just as good as it did when it was brand new and whenever I drive it I fall in love with it all over again...can't keep the smile off :biggrin

For daily driving duties, I prefer to drive my ZHP. It performs well above my expectation and I don't miss driving the M3 as much. It's fun factor is up there with the M3. Since I commute between 50-60 miles every work day and going over the Newport Bridge is like driving over cobblestone roads at 60mph, I prefer driving the ZHP. The ride is more forgiving over the ride in the M3 but the suspension is tight, not soft. I still feel the road but it's not as harsh like it is in my M3.

Now for the scale:
Comfort - 10 (still on OEM suspension @ 110k)
Acceleration - 8 (I have Afe CAI and Shark tuned)
Braking - 8 (I installed BMW performance rotors, ceramic pads, and stainless steel braided lines)
Fun to Drive - 10

One of the best things I enjoy about owning my ZHP is that it is not a "standard" 330i so it's more unique over the rest of the 3-series line with exception of being an M3. I love the fact that mine is Imola Red (BMW Motorsport reserved colors). Basically, the next best thing you can get. I hope this helps.

If you desire the ultimate coupe, don't mind the stiffer ride and want power then it's an obvious choice....get the M3 :biggrin Either way, I don't think you will regret your choice. I am lucky in that I have both:thumbsup


Thanks for taking the time to detail your experience between your two cars. Just three more questions for now :)

1. How much have you spent maintaining the ZHP?
2. Over what period of time did you spend the $5k on the M3/

Here's the big one
3. If you could only keep one, which car would it be?

Thanks again!!

[M0nk3y]

Thanks for taking the time to detail your experience between your two cars. Just three more questions for now :)

1. How much have you spent maintaining the ZHP?
2. Over what period of time did you spend the $5k on the M3/

Here's the big one
3. If you could only keep one, which car would it be?

Thanks again!!

Just from my experience on my S54, I had to do Inspection I + Valves (would of been $800 about w/out CPO) and I went through an ignition coil ($50).

From owning it since March...I already did $850 essentially in service, just saying. It will add up quick

[cakM3]

Thanks for taking the time to detail your experience between your two cars. Just three more questions for now :)

1. How much have you spent maintaining the ZHP?
2. Over what period of time did you spend the $5k on the M3/

Here's the big one
3. If you could only keep one, which car would it be?

Thanks again!!

This year I had to do Insp II which I also did a VANOS rebuild. This ran me $2500. I also replaced my suspension and added coilovers which ran be an additional $1500. Then I replaced my water pump/thermostat, pullies, hoses which ran me an additional $1k. So all in all $5k as of now. It does add up quick.

The ZHP on the other hand ran me just over $1k since I got it. I replaced my brakes/rotors the first week I got it and am now looking at Insp II for it. The good thing is that Insp II for the ZHP is considerably lower than Insp II for the M. I'm looking at 700 and change for Insp II.

Regarding your last question....N/A. I won't allow myself to get to that situation. I love both cars and am lucky enough to have a job that will allow me to keep and maintain both cars. :biggrin For me, each car have their unique personalities which mesh with my priorities. When taking people around or grabbing things, the ZHP is a perfect fit for that task and when just cruising by myself my M3 is perfect for that. I have always had two cars and don't see that part changing anytime soon...:biggrin

[sea6speed]

I looked at how many build problems the 99-00 E46 owners have and decided I'd rather own the last year of a production run than the first. Plus, the amount of knowledge out there about fixing and maintaining E46's is light years ahead of E9x's. I decided if I was going to (or will) own an E9x, it's going to be under CPO or factory warranty. My spending cap was a bit higher, so for me the decision was made on 1) expected depreciation over 36 months of ownership 2) repairs and maintenence. E46 was the clear winner in depreciation VS a CPO E9x, and so far the repairs and maintenence have been less than $100/mo averaged out.