E46 BMW 330 ZHP Buyers Corner -- Is it a good deal?

[nickershocker]

Supposedly, a dealer offered the seller $12k. I said take the dealer's offer. Official WTB coming tomorrow. Now, I sleep.

[jdhouseman87]

Hi everybody, my name is Josh, I am from Southeast Missouri, and I am new to the site. I have been checking out this site for a month or two while I have been waiting to graduate college and finally buy a ZHP. Anyway I figured what better place to start and hopefully find the right one than here. I was hoping that you all could take a look at the ZHPs I found on autotrader.com

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=298776933&dealer_id=65657289&model=330I&start_year=2003&body_style=COUPE&body_style=SEDAN&search_type=both&distance=500&advanced=y&end_year=2006&make2=BMW&transmission=Manual&default_sort=priceASC&address=63701&model2=330CI&seller_type=b&make=BMW

The big things I’m looking for in a ZHP are here like the 6spd and the color. I am a big fan of the black, white, and grey/silver cars so this one looks very nice. I talked to the seller today and he was very nice and extremely quick to respond, and from what he said he knows a thing or two about BMWs.
I also found this car but it might be sold, I am not sure.

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=298833675&dealer_id=100026816&model=330I&start_year=2003&body_style=COUPE&body_style=SEDAN&search_type=both&distance=500&advanced=y&end_year=2006&make2=BMW&transmission=Manual&default_sort=priceASC&address=63701&model2=330CI&seller_type=b&make=BMW

and finally this ZHP

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=p&car_id=298795022&dealer_id=66242457&model=330I&start_year=2003&body_style=COUPE&body_style=SEDAN&search_type=both&distance=500&advanced=y&end_year=2006&make2=BMW&transmission=Manual&default_sort=priceASC&address=63701&model2=330CI&seller_type=b&make=BMW

Anyway thank you all for your time and help! I am sorry if I posted something wrong, I am new to this forum thing.
Thanks again
Josh

[danewilson77]

Welcome to the Mafia Josh. You'll find your car....no doubt. Be patient.

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Hi everybody, my name is Josh, I am from Southeast Missouri, and I am new to the site. I have been checking out this site for a month or two while I have been waiting to graduate college and finally buy a ZHP. Anyway I figured what better place to start and hopefully find the right one than here. I was hoping that you all could take a look at the ZHPs I found on autotrader.com

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=298776933&dealer_id=65657289&model=330I&start_year=2003&body_style=COUPE&body_style=SEDAN&search_type=both&distance=500&advanced=y&end_year=2006&make2=BMW&transmission=Manual&default_sort=priceASC&address=63701&model2=330CI&seller_type=b&make=BMW

The big things I’m looking for in a ZHP are here like the 6spd and the color. I am a big fan of the black, white, and grey/silver cars so this one looks very nice. I talked to the seller today and he was very nice and extremely quick to respond, and from what he said he knows a thing or two about BMWs.
I also found this car but it might be sold, I am not sure.

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=298833675&dealer_id=100026816&model=330I&start_year=2003&body_style=COUPE&body_style=SEDAN&search_type=both&distance=500&advanced=y&end_year=2006&make2=BMW&transmission=Manual&default_sort=priceASC&address=63701&model2=330CI&seller_type=b&make=BMW

and finally this ZHP

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=p&car_id=298795022&dealer_id=66242457&model=330I&start_year=2003&body_style=COUPE&body_style=SEDAN&search_type=both&distance=500&advanced=y&end_year=2006&make2=BMW&transmission=Manual&default_sort=priceASC&address=63701&model2=330CI&seller_type=b&make=BMW

Anyway thank you all for your time and help! I am sorry if I posted something wrong, I am new to this forum thing.
Thanks again
Josh

Josh, that first one (the 2005 ZHP coupe in black) is overpriced. You should not pay $16,295 for a ZHP with more than 100,000 miles on it. It's better priced in the $12K-$14K range. That seller will soon learn that the price is too high when no one buys it.

The second listing is no longer available.

The third listing should be priced at around $14K. It has 82,000 miles.

Your post here was perfect. You did everything right.

Welcome to the site.

[jdhouseman87]

Thanks very much guys, I am grateful for the help and comments. Having only had older cars in the past and no luxury cars, it's hard for me to know what is a good price. Also do people tend to ask a bit higher for the cars than they think they can get for bargaining room and how much is that usually? Anyway here are two new finds, the first one looks like it needs a good cleaning, (mostly in the engine bay, I don’t know if this is a sign of poor care?) and they both have the Alcantra cloth. For some reason I prefer the leather but it all works for me. If anybody has an argument for or against one interior over the other I would be happy to listen. Thanks again everybody.
Josh
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=298322257&dealer_id=65594231&car_year=2005&systime=&doors=&model=330CI&search_lang=en&start_year=2003&body_style=COUPE&body_style=SEDAN&keywordsfyc=&keywordsrep=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=both&distance=500&min_price=&rdm=1305041291473&drive=&marketZipError=false&advanced=y&fuel=&keywords_display=&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2006&make3=&showZipError=n&make2=BMW&certified=&engine=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=10&transmission=Manual&default_sort=priceASC&max_mileage=&color=&address=63701&sort_type=priceASC&model2=330I&max_price=&awsp=false&make=BMW&seller_type=b&num_records=25&cardist=375&standard=false
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=p&car_id=299596313&dealer_id=66277671&car_year=2003&systime=&doors=&model=330CI&search_lang=en&start_year=2003&body_style=COUPE&body_style=SEDAN&keywordsfyc=&keywordsrep=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=both&distance=500&min_price=&rdm=1305041291473&drive=&marketZipError=false&advanced=y&fuel=&keywords_display=&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2006&make3=&showZipError=n&make2=BMW&certified=&engine=&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=10&transmission=Manual&default_sort=priceASC&max_mileage=&color=&address=63701&sort_type=priceASC&model2=330I&max_price=&awsp=false&make=BMW&seller_type=b&num_records=25&cardist=305&standard=false&rdpage=thumb

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Josh, I believe that MOST people overprice the car. They expect some haggling and they price appropriately.

The first car you listed does not have the stock wheels. Not sure how important it is for you to have the style 135M wheels, but I would not own my car without them. I love the style 135 wheel that come with my car.

Also, the dealer is listing that car at nearly $15,000 for a car that has more than 100,000 miles. Again, I would not personally pay that much for a car with that many miles. That's me, though. You'll need to figure out if you would.

The engine bay is filthy. It will likely clean right up. However, I do use the cleanliness of a car as a factor in my buying decision. The dirty engine bay could mean that the previous owner just wasn't as anal as me. It may also be a sign that other things were neglected, too. It really just means that I will be taking a closer look at the car. Consider: would you sell your house without cutting your lawn? Would you have huge weeds in the front yard? If you aren't willing to do that, what else have you allowed to get out of hand?

So that's what a dirty engine bay means to me.

That second car in Cincinnati is better priced. It has 71,000 miles and it's listed at $15,000. It's a 2003, so I tend to discount those a little bit (given the age). I also tend to discount when the car is located in a more remote location (in the United States). I'd try to work the price down a bit.

[sqweak]

Any thoughts on this one?
http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=842358

Not the sedan I wanted, but seems like a good deal on a low mileage tastefully modded 1 owner zhp. Any Cali Mafioso know if the ess ts2 will pass smog?

[Marcus-SanDiego]

The price is right. Sounds like the guy just wants to liquidate the car. He has a 2007 Cayman now. He tried selling it for $16K earlier this year. No bites. Dropping it down to $14,500 now.

Not sure if the ESS TS2 presents smog cert issues. You'll need to do some homework on that end.

[sqweak]

According to ESS on E46F.c it's not carb exempt. They say it will pass sniffer but could fail visual. Owner posts I've found seem promising. One failed visual and passed after covering the SC w/ another engine cover section. The other passed on first try w/o trying to hide anything. :scratchinghead

Sounds kinda risky. can't decide if it's worth the hassle. :dunno

[Marcus-SanDiego]

There is always someone out there who will pass you on visual. You just have to find that person (assuming you do not pass).

Let us know if you buy the car!

[macpro_racer2010]

Not sure if this car has been posted on the forum before, I searched around and could not find anything. What do you guys think about this car. I believe its priced a little high, perhaps 17.5K-18K would be better price? Any thoughts?

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=p&car_id=292286675&dealer_id=65951341&car_year=2005&useImpressions=true&listingCounter=0&model=330CI&adModel=330CI&pager.offset=75&search_lang=en&start_year=2004&body_style=CONVERT&body_style=COUPE&body_style=SEDAN&search_type=both&distance=0&min_price=10000&rdm=1305230395730&marketZipError=false&advanced=y&listingPriority=20&flip=a&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2006&showZipError=y&make2=BMW&adBodyStyle=CONVERT,COUPE,SEDAN,TRADERNA&page_location=findacar::ispsearchform&body_code=11&first_record=76&transmission=Manual&default_sort=priceDESC&max_mileage=100000&useBIRF=true&address=31401&model2=330I&sort_type=priceDESC&adMake=BMW&videoSpotlightType=a&awsp=false&adClassSeries=3_SERIES&make=BMW&num_records=25&seller_type=b&cardist=238&LNX=ESTAFSRCHUSDTEXT

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Not listed on the site before. I will list it now. Will comment afterward.

[bmshen]

Might have located another candidate for me here in the Bay Area that I hope to look at tomorrow. 03 silver ZHP w/ 72K miles, nav, leather, xenon. AutoCheck is clear of accidents; not sure if the owner is the original owner or not (we have been trading voicemails), but he advertises that he has maintenance records. What is a fair price?

[Marcus-SanDiego]

I'd think that about $14K is a fair price. Maybe $14,500.

[pleasecorrupt]

+1 considering the age of the car and the mileage i think 14k is the magic # you're aiming for.

[bmshen]

thank you both...wish me luck that this is the right one!

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Good luck!

[sqweak]

http://orangecounty.craigslist.org/cto/2368857187.html

price seems good. mileage scares me a little. Any thoughts?

[Marcus-SanDiego]

The mileage would not necessarily scare me. Instead, I'd try to knock the price down a little bit. Because cars always pop up, I would try to get this one for $11,500-$12,000. California cars tend to be a bit cheaper than they'd be on the east coast.

Still, at 100,000 miles you really do want to see the maintenance records. Make sure that car has been properly maintained during the past 7+ years.

[sqweak]

exactly what i was thinking on price. Great minds. ;) Current owner says he has records from 60k-current. Trying to set up a viewing.

[sqweak]

Ugh.

I agreed to buy a ZHP ci pending ppi, arranged financing, offered a deposit, and dude sold it out from under me during time he told me he'd be out of town.

Peeved.

[danewilson77]

Ugh.

I agreed to buy a ZHP ci pending ppi, arranged financing, offered a deposit, and dude sold it out from under me during time he told me he'd be out of town.

Peeved.

Damn. Not nice.

Mafia.....mount up!

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Corey, I wish I could say that I am surprised, but I am not. During my search last summer, there were so many pathetic sellers. It was a rather frustrating experience. And even when the seller provided buyers with a lot of information, many sellers often omitted key facts about the car -- such as, oh yeah, hitting a deer with the car.

Patience, my friend.

P.S., who was the seller? Someone on this forum? Someone on another forum?

[aurelius]

Ugh.

I agreed to buy a ZHP ci pending ppi, arranged financing, offered a deposit, and dude sold it out from under me during time he told me he'd be out of town.

Peeved.

You'll find sellers with something to hide often avoid knowledgeable buyers...

[sqweak]

Thanks for letting me vent. ;)

Marcus: don't think he's on here, at least the car isn't posted here. I don't want to put him on blast publicly but since we talked about the car/deal at BF I'm sure you can connect the dots. :D

I've got a local sedan I'm trying to see, considering a m3, and starting to consider e90s. We'll see what the next few weeks brings.

[rikdee]

Consider E90 with caution: they are difficult to work on with a completely panned underside, have small differentials without a drain plug, highly electronic, no radiator drains claiming lifetime fill, no spare, no dipstick, and are designed to be dealer-centric. They are very nice cars but think forward. I do own an E90 as well as two E46 cars. Going back to the time, I would now have purchased a slightly used E46 rather than the new '06 E90 I bought. Read Mike Miller for further elucidation.

[rikdee]

Correction. E90s do have a radiator drain plug but do not have a engine block drain plug as with our M54s. I understand one has to remove radiator hoses to drain the block. This is one operation I have yet to tackle but have it on the calendar. Lifetime fills, nein danke!

[sqweak]

Thanks for the pointers Rik! I'll read up on them further.

[nickershocker]

What is about the right price for an east coast 2005 zhp sedan, black on black, black leather steering wheel, silver cube trim, 69k miles, 6MT, cold weather and premium package, no nav, all stock(no mods), good maintenance records (done at BMW - WAS under maintenance plan). Maintenance includes Timing belt, Head gasket was replaced about 5k ago as well as water pump and thermostat. No accidents shown on autocheck.
(I think $16k sounds about right.)

[kayger12]

The head gasket replacement along with water pump and thermostat is a sign that this car had a cooling system failure and overheated. I'd be asking a lot of questions about that. Can cause lots of damage and motor issues.

Also, these cars don't have a timing belt, so I'm not sure what they're referring to with that. If they had to do the timing chain, that would be another indication that there was some major head warping due to an overheat condition, iirc (someone with more motor knowledge will hopefully jump in on this).
I would personally steer way clear of this one.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

The head gasket replacement along with water pump and thermostat is a sign that this car had a cooling system failure and overheated. I'd be asking a lot of questions about that. Can cause lots of damage and motor issues.

Also, these cars don't have a timing belt, so I'm not sure what they're referring to with that. If they had to do the timing chain, that would be another indication that there was some major head warping due to an overheat condition, iirc (someone with more motor knowledge will hopefully jump in on this).
I would personally steer way clear of this one.

+1.

I hate stories. I hate explanations. I hate not knowing what really happened.

I would keep looking.

[danewilson77]

What is about the right price for an east coast 2005 zhp sedan, black on black, black leather steering wheel, silver cube trim, 69k miles, 6MT, cold weather and premium package, no nav, all stock(no mods), good maintenance records (done at BMW - WAS under maintenance plan). Maintenance includes Timing belt, Head gasket was replaced about 5k ago as well as water pump and thermostat. No accidents shown on autocheck.
(I think $16k sounds about right.)

I agree.

I got mine for $17.2k. It was listed @ $19.5k. I still think I paid more than I should have. My cars name is Private Ryan. I am saving it.

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

[nickershocker]

Thanks for the advice. I wasn't thinking about what could've gone wrong to necessitate those repairs. Maybe I'll call the dealer that serviced it and see if I can get any info out of them. Otherwise, the search will continue.

[danewilson77]

Thanks for the advice. I wasn't thinking about what could've gone wrong to necessitate those repairs. Maybe I'll call the dealer that serviced it and see if I can get any info out of them. Otherwise, the search will continue.

I am going to go out on a linb...and say most likely....either a belt or pulley failed which overheated the car....and blew the head gasket.

IMHO....this car isn't for you.

[nickershocker]

I am going to go out on a linb...and say most likely....either a belt or pulley failed which overheated the car....and blew the head gasket.

IMHO....this car isn't for you.

So, now he is saying that it was a valve cover gasket and not a head gasket. Considering he thought the car had a timing belt, it sounds like he was just ignorant of what was done to his car at the stealership. He claims car has never overheated. Given the updated info, how does $16k sound?

[aurelius]

So, now he is saying that it was a valve cover gasket and not a head gasket. Considering he thought the car had a timing belt, it sounds like he was just ignorant of what was done to his car at the stealership. He claims car has never overheated. Given the updated info, how does $16k sound?

Just ask to see the service records and verify for yourself that it was indeed the VCG and also verify the timing chain was NOT worked on.

If it was only the VCG and the serpentine/accessory belt that were actually replaced, then that would be perfectly normal for a M54 motor at that mileage.

If you buy it, get the records so you can determine the remainder of the usual cooling system suspects you'll have to replace. Including but not limited to a whole series of pulleys and the 2 major radiator hoses. And don't forget that expansion tank, which has been the perp in many a premature M54 death.

[danewilson77]

^+1.

Big diff between VCG and HG.

[MAS]

guys I'm having a tough time trying to decide between a ZHP and a e39 540i with the M-Sport package. All the ZHP's I'm finding seem a little over priced here on the east coast or they have some issues that I don't want to compromise on. I know the crowd here may be slightly biased ;-) but has anyone that has drove both give me an honest opinion?

[aurelius]

guys I'm having a tough time trying to decide between a ZHP and a e39 540i with the M-Sport package. All the ZHP's I'm finding seem a little over priced here on the east coast or they have some issues that I don't want to compromise on. I know the crowd here may be slightly biased ;-) but has anyone that has drove both give me an honest opinion?

I always loved that e39 Sport but when I was shopping for e39's, I quickly learned 2 things: the V8 from that era is trouble and the mpg you get from the 540 Sport is insanely bad.

Ended up with a e39 530 Sport, manual. But the relationship ended early when I was offered a screaming deal on a ZHP.

[MAS]

aurelius, i know about the terrible mpg's but whats the deal with the v8?

Yeah I'm still waiting on finding a screaming ZHP deal. Whats interesting is that the best deals I've seen on autotrader have been ZHP's in your area of Dallas and Austin.

[danewilson77]

guys I'm having a tough time trying to decide between a ZHP and a e39 540i with the M-Sport package. All the ZHP's I'm finding seem a little over priced here on the east coast or they have some issues that I don't want to compromise on. I know the crowd here may be slightly biased ;-) but has anyone that has drove both give me an honest opinion?

You are correct. The Easties bring a premium price when compared to Westies.

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

[aurelius]

aurelius, i know about the terrible mpg's but whats the deal with the v8?

Yeah I'm still waiting on finding a screaming ZHP deal. Whats interesting is that the best deals I've seen on autotrader have been ZHP's in your area of Dallas and Austin.

Sorry, I don't recall the specifics of what is problematic with that V8. There was a e39 buyer's guide / market update in Bimmer Magazine a while back.

As for ZHP's, also check out Dallas.Craigslist. Assuming you're willing to travel. There is a huge volume of wholesale dealer auction activity here and I think it contributes to local supply and lower prices.

Not that you want an auction car with no verifiable history but private sellers have to keep prices in line with the overall market. Much of what you will see on craigs is at independent dealers who get their inventory at the auctions. But there are also private sellers.

Bottom line, be willing to travel and be ready with the finances. The good ZHP's go very quickly, especially as they gain a cult following.

[The Heretic]

Found this on autotrader. It is exactly what I am looking and fully loaded...at what point do you pay up for exactly what you want? :)
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=p&car_id=285136202&dealer_id=65606141&car_year=2004&systime=&doors=&model=330I&search_lang=en&start_year=1981&keywordsfyc=__emhw__&keywordsrep=122104112&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=used&distance=0&min_price=&rdm=1307385161247&drive=&marketZipError=false&advanced=y&fuel=&keywords_display=zhp&sownerid=73218&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2012&showZipError=y&make2=&certified=&engine=&dma=SAN_FRANCISCO-OAK-SAN_JOSE_EA&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=0&transmission=&default_sort=priceDESC&max_mileage=&color=&address=94596&sort_type=priceDESC&max_price=&make=BMW&seller_type=b&num_records=25&cardist=2141&standard=false

[rikdee]

I have always bought exactly the car I wanted and never looked back at the price. You are the one who needs to be happy with the purchase. Who cares how others perceive relative value? Buy the car you want and enjoy!

[Marcus-SanDiego]

I'm with Rik on this one. If I find something, and it's exactly what I want, I go for it.

I still use logic, of course, but if it's close enough to your price, then I wouldn't hesitate.

[The Heretic]

Did you guys get a chance to take a look at the ad? The owner is going to send me pictures tomorrow which he says there isn't one thing wrong with the car. For me shipping would be about $1000. The guy has had the car for sale for 6 months and the price is still at $25K. Would you even CONSIDER that? Becasue I am...I think. High NADA is $23,000. Really would like to get it as close to $20K as possible but don't think that will happen.

If I am patient I will likely be able to be a 60K for around $18K. Is 40K less in mileage worth $5K to $6K more?

Thoughts appreciated

[Washburn]

to compare, i got my 2005 AW Zhp coupe with 12k miles in pristine condition for almost $ 20k incl. shipping. Had cold weather pkg, but not premium or nav.
IDK if that helps you or not.,,,$25k is pretty high, IMO, but then again, you get everything you want, and it does have nav. (for me the CW pkg was more imp than nav, to tell the truth).

[Oli77]

My 2 cents. I have read often that a car with very very low miles (like this one) should be approached carefully. This opinion was based on people arguing that if the car was not driven regularly, seals may tend to break left and right upon daily driving.

The other thing is that some of our members may be near Cleveland OH, and may be able to go look at the car for you. Perhaps even test drive it.

We should set up a "drive my potential purchase" thread to help each other even more than we already do.

Bosses, what dya think?

[Washburn]

That's a great idea -

CORRECTION: Mine had 12k miles when I got it - not 20k (previous post edited and corrected)
i also got mine with very low miles, and I know that one can't check all the seals and everything, but I had a reputed place check it out and perform a very thorough PP inspection on it. I also flew to the owner and test drove it myself.
I guess some amount of risk is there, and one should be ready to deal with those but then it can also be with a high mileage car...

I have doubled the miles on mine within 9 months of ownership, and have driven it a lot, and everything has been tip-top so far. I am glad mine only has 21k or so right now, and I am glad i went with a low mile specimen.

[nickershocker]

We should set up a "drive my potential purchase" thread to help each other even more than we already do.

I'll test drive cars in Maryland. I don't know if that helps anyone.

Also, bringing some good news. I purchased a 6MT black/black leather 2005 zhp sedan. I am loving it. I just got the chance to give her a quick wash. Pictures coming soon. I am looking forward to contributing to the group.

[Oli77]

Yeah! stuff like that I super helpful and we should take advantage of each others' prior experience with these cars.

For example, my car was about 3 hours away and I could not test drive it. It just happened that a friend of mine (driver of many minis) was near the town in question. His input was very important to me. Car looked very clean, did not pull to the sides on breaking, was strong and quiet.

To be fair he missed a few things, but so did I when I eventually drove down to pick it up.

[rikdee]

I wouldn't necessary assume low miles as a harbinger for problems. In fact, low mileage is always my first search criterion for any pre-owned BMW I ever purchased. I am always willing to pay for low miles, the lower the better. I might be concerned if a car had a long storage history and never driven as opposed to a car driven at a low mileage pace. I bought my ZHP in March of '09 with 4,965 miles. Doing a PPI myself, I found nothing untoward. FF to present and the car is still like new. Other low mileage Bimmers I have purchased had the same result; I like the idea of buying essentially a new car long after it was born.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

I agree. Low mileage is desirable to me. However, when I do find something with low miles, I check to see what the maintenance has been like on the car. In and of itself, though, I prefer a low-mileage car.

Always have to do your homework.

[aurelius]

I have experience with older cars that have small numbers on the odometer.

As for that Imola ZHP on AT, if the seller doesn't drive it and the mileage now is about what it was when first posted online, the only likely issue would be bad gas (due to age).

If the fuel smells bad and more like varnish than gasoline, the tank needs draining. Which would be easy to do on a lift while replacing the fuel filter/pressure reg.

Bring something with you that's long enough to press on the flap inside the fuel filler mouth and get yourself a good whiff.

Either way, get some fuel system cleaner. Redline now sells such a product. Or Lubro Moly's Jectron and Ventil Sauber (valve cleaner). Part #'s 2001 & 2007 at bavauto.com.

Easier to find locally would be a bottle of Techron (Chevron or Texaco) or Lucas fuel injection cleaner (walmart).

Note: the bottles in which these products are packaged often don't fit all the way into a BMW fuel filler opening. You may need a long funnel to get the stuff into the gas tank without spilling it all over the side of the car.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Mark, nice post.

[rikdee]

I agree. Low mileage is desirable to me. However, when I do find something with low miles, I check to see what the maintenance has been like on the car. In and of itself, though, I prefer a low-mileage car.

Always have to do your homework.

Yeah, homework is part of the equation. If nothing else, at least know something about what you're buying. I've always assumed low mileage examples as having less probability of hidden problems. And, I have worked on Bimmers long enough to know what to look for. Low mileage cars pretty much eliminate "wear" as an issue which, by itself, takes a lot of concern off the table.
From my view, the real risk with our cars is on the electronic side. These items can be difficult to spot; even a good professional PPI can overlook problems in this area. But, buying a pre-owned, private party vehicle can never be without a modicum of risk.
This, then, goes back to the notion of doing as much preparation as possible in knowing your quarry...

[Marcus-SanDiego]

This, then, goes back to the notion of doing as much preparation as possible in knowing your quarry...

Indeed. That's why I typically do as much homework about the owner as possible. Last year, when I bought my ZHP, I read every post ever created by the previous owner. I wanted to see what might have happened to the car during the years that he owned it.

[Washburn]

As for fuel system cleaners, Techron (i didn't have trouble puring it in), which is rebottled as BMW stuff, Gumout Regane and Redline Sl-1, all have very good amount of PEA. All 3 are decent. Redline sl-1 has the added function that it can also work as an UCL.

[rikdee]

Indeed. That's why I typically do as much homework about the owner as possible. Last year, when I bought my ZHP, I read every post ever created by the previous owner. I wanted to see what might have happened to the car during the years that he owned it.

During the mid-sixties, I think the Marvelettes cautioned the unwary: "When the Hunter Gets Captured by the Game"...

[Marcus-SanDiego]

^ :thumbup

[MAS]

what do you guys think of this one? Is this a fair price for the mileage?

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?car_id=300180550&dealer_id=63673545&ct=u&carid_search=1

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Way too high. More than 70K miles and going for $20K? No way. It should be closer to $16K.

[pleasecorrupt]

Way too high. More than 70K miles and going for $20K? No way. It should be closer to $16K.

+1 got the same exact car 50k miles for 17.4k patience and private sellers are usually the best way to go

[MAS]

Way too high. More than 70K miles and going for $20K? No way. It should be closer to $16K.

thanks for taking a look Marcus. its pretty much exactly what i'm looking for minus the high mileage.

[Chernobyl Prize]

ZHP gurus what are your thoughts on this one?
http://sacramento.craigslist.org/ctd/2426576706.html

It's a 2006 coupe with 112,000 miles with a dealer price of $19,988
I'm a ZHP noob but the shifter knob is wrong, right?

[Marcus-SanDiego]

That's the knob that comes on the automatic ZHP.

As for the price, that's a joke. $20K for a car with 112,000 miles? Please. That's ridiculous.

Try about $13K or so. That's more in line with a car with those miles.

[bmshen]

Chernobyl, I picked up my ZHP sedan with 72,000 miles for $14k about three weeks ago from a private party in Sonoma. What are you specifically looking for? Coupe or sedan? Auto or manual? Price range?

[Chernobyl Prize]

Thanks Marcus, I was thinking along those lines.

I'd like a coupe, I don't have much preference for auto vs manual. I'd go up to $18,000 or so if I found the perfect car. My first color preference would be grey but I like the blue and black as well. I love the black leather interior, I haven't seen anything else that looks nearly as good.

[BCS_ZHP]

Chernobyl Prize,
Look at my sig -- '05 coupe, silver gray, black leather, 54K miles, automatic, everything is up to date or ahead maintenance-wise. I'll going to change the rotors, brakes, sensors, and brake fluid in the morning. I live in Northern Virginia, PM me if you're interested. In the interest of full disclosure, my son's best friend backed into the door on Memorial Day weekend when the car was parked. I took it to my friend of 30+ years who owns a body shop and had the whole door replaced, he had his best guys work on it, the paint match is perfect. 99% of the people would never be able to tell it was fixed but I'm being honest about it. Pm me if you're interested.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

And the great thing is that we can vouch for bruce. Honest guy.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

[kayger12]

And the great thing is that we can vouch for bruce. Honest guy.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

+1... and his cars are meticulously cared for.

Droid X. Tapatalk. Use it.

[Chernobyl Prize]

PM sent.

[BCS_ZHP]

Back at ya, check PM. Let's talk, gave you my thoughts, we can work thru it if you want it.

[edlvrt]

Gentlemen,

I have been looking around for a ZHP for a while and found one fairly close to home. I was hoping to tap into the wealth of knowledge here and see what yall think.

2004 ZHP, 70500 miles, asking $15,000 from a private party, 2nd owner.
6 spd
Black Sapphire Metallic, black interior with Natural Brown Interior, black cube trim
Xenon headlights
Alcantera steering wheel
Folding rear seats
It was a COP car and all maintenance has been done at a BMW Center, though I would have preferred more than what BMW suggests

The seller is sending more pictures and the Carfax shortly.

What do you think?

Thanks

Ed

[pleasecorrupt]

Pretty good price, got my zhp same interior and color for 17.4k 50k miles. yours in on the lower end of the ball park ill go for it assuming everything checks out

[nickershocker]

Good price. Get a ppi. If it checks out, then jump on it (IMO). If you are looking to get a car in the next month, then get autocheck for a month. It is nice when autocheck and carfax check out and the ppi goes well. Good luck.

[danewilson77]

It was a cop car FTW!

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

[edlvrt]

It was a cop car FTW!

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

What now?:dunno

Autocheck has green checks across the board.

[danewilson77]

What now?:dunno

Autocheck has green checks across the board.

Test drive and ppi....

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

[edlvrt]

Two things that raise a question with the car:

1) Owner says that it suffered rear bumper damage after a parking attendant did not set the parking break and he had the rear bumper fixed.

2) Car fax shows "A/C and heating system checked" at the dealer 3 times within the last 10,000 miles. Don't know what that means, but my worst fear is an AC leak somewhere under the dash. Can a PPI determine anything related to this?

I'm gonna go check it out soon.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Just make sure you let the mechanic know that you're worried about the AC system. Tell him to be vigilant.

[nickershocker]

Two things that raise a question with the car:

1) Owner says that it suffered rear bumper damage after a parking attendant did not set the parking break and he had the rear bumper fixed.

2) Car fax shows "A/C and heating system checked" at the dealer 3 times within the last 10,000 miles. Don't know what that means, but my worst fear is an AC leak somewhere under the dash. Can a PPI determine anything related to this?

I'm gonna go check it out soon.

1) Make sure it has the correct (ZHP) rear bumper. If it does, PPI should be able to tell you if it is original.
2) Ask the seller some questions about the A/C heating system. Ask lots of questions. Ask for service records. Call dealer and ask them questions if you are concerned about the service records.

The value of these cars depend so much on their care. You are going to have to repair/replace things at some point on your future ZHP. Make sure you get a feel to what will have to be replaced in the near term and factor it into the price.

My first email/call on every car I looked at became: "What is the VIN? What has been serviced on the car other than brakes/tires/oil changes? Has it ever been in an accident? Is there anything that you know is wrong with the car?"

As far as sellers disclosing what is wrong with the car: there are honest sellers, dishonest sellers, and ignorant (Webster's definition) sellers. Stay away from the dishonest sellers.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

1) Make sure it has the correct (ZHP) rear bumper. If it does, PPI should be able to tell you if it is original.
2) Ask the seller some questions about the A/C heating system. Ask lots of questions. Ask for service records. Call dealer and ask them questions if you are concerned about the service records.

The value of these cars depend so much on their care. You are going to have to repair/replace things at some point on your future ZHP. Make sure you get a feel to what will have to be replaced in the near term and factor it into the price.

My first email/call on every car I looked at became: "What is the VIN? What has been serviced on the car other than brakes/tires/oil changes? Has it ever been in an accident? Is there anything that you know is wrong with the car?"

As far as sellers disclosing what is wrong with the car: there are honest sellers, dishonest sellers, and ignorant (Webster's definition) sellers. Stay away from the dishonest sellers.

+1

[joeybatz]

Hi I'm a new member.

I'm about to buy 1 of 2 cars. One is a ZHP and the other is a standard 330ci. Yes I know this is a ZHP site but I'm still torn as to which is a better deal.

Standard 330ci is a 2004 76K miles $14,000 sport pkg, cold pkg, xenon, leather

The ZHP is also a coupe 62K miles $17,000 Fully loaded as well

Both seem to be in great condition...clear carfaxes...non ZHP is a private seller and ZHP is a dealer.

$17000 would be my budget and ZHP is totally bad ass but Im concerned ZHP my be costlier as repairs start coming my way.

What do you guys suggest?

Joey

[kayger12]

Repairs won't be any more costly on the ZHP-- almost all parts are the same between the two cars.

If you're not bent on getting a ZHP, I would get the car that has the better maintenance history. That tends to be the most important thing with these cars.

[danewilson77]

Get zhp....immediately.....after ppi.

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

[nickershocker]

I had found myself in a very similar circumstance. I went with the better service history, which was the zhp. Another thing to consider is that the zhp will likely hold it's value slightly better than the non zhp.

Also, is the dealer advertising as zhp or performance package? Consider this in your negotiation. Don't reveal there is anything special about the car if they don't know. Remember dealers are Salesman, not car enthusiasts. Don't feel bad lowballing a dealer. If you're not gonna get your service there, you never have to see them again.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

I don't think that you'll get much of an argument from most people that a ZHP and a stock 330 -- all things being equal -- would have about a $3000 difference in price. I tend to see that differential in the real world. ZHPs command a premium over a stock 330 without ZHP package.

If you agree with my assertion, then the ZHP is the better deal. Why? Because it has 14,000 less miles on it. Remember, I'm arguing that each car would have equal things -- including mileage -- and the cars would have a $3,000 differential in price. Given that these two cars do not have equal mileage (the ZHP is lower), the ZHP looks to be better priced here.

But that, of course, also assumes that the maintenance history stacks up equally for the two cars as well. That could be the deal breaker that brings the 330 (non ZHP) back in the lead.

Check the maintenance history. If they're both equally good, then I'd opt for the ZHP, since it would appear to have the better price.

[daelsc]

I'm talking with a friend about buying his ZHP. He's upgrading to an M3. We're trying to determine a price that is fair for both of us.

I've known the owner, and the car, for several years. He purchased it in January 2009 with 44,000 miles. He is extremely meticulous with everything he owns and has kept the car in pristine condition. It is immaculate inside and out. You can literally eat off the door sills....but don't do that as the car has never been eaten in.

Here are the specs:

2004 330i Sedan w/ ZHP Performance Package
6-speed manual transmission
Alpine White exterior
Black Alcantara/Cloth with Black Cube Interior
63,000 miles
Serviced personally by the owner since purchase in 1/2009. Service records at BMW dealer by original owner for prior services.
Front/Rear Bridgestone Potenza RE-11 tires with good life left.
No accidents, original everything.


And the bad:
Minor curbing on the wheels from the original owner
Cosmetic scratches on interior plastics around the e-brake from the original owner's finger nails.
The car has a Manufacture Buyback Title. We researched it when he purchased the car. Speaking with the dealer who sold and serviced the car to the original owner they explained that there was a reoccurring issue with the memory module in the side view mirrors. He has owned the car since 2009 and has had no issues with the mirrors, or the car, since purchasing it. I am confident that the car is mechanically sound I just have concerns over the title's impact on the resale value.

I'm eager for your thoughts...

[kayger12]

I don't think that you'll get much of an argument from most people that a ZHP and a stock 330 -- all things being equal -- would have about a $3000 difference in price. I tend to see that differential in the real world. ZHPs command a premium over a stock 330 without ZHP package.

If you agree with my assertion, then the ZHP is the better deal. Why? Because it has 14,000 less miles on it. Remember, I'm arguing that each car would have equal things -- including mileage -- and the cars would have a $3,000 differential in price. Given that these two cars do not have equal mileage (the ZHP is lower), the ZHP looks to be better priced here.

But that, of course, also assumes that the maintenance history stacks up equally for the two cars as well. That could be the deal breaker that brings the 330 (non ZHP) back in the lead.

Check the maintenance history. If they're both equally good, then I'd opt for the ZHP, since it would appear to have the better price.

+1. Well said.

[kayger12]

I'm talking with a friend about buying his ZHP. He's upgrading to an M3. We're trying to determine a price that is fair for both of us.

I've known the owner, and the car, for several years. He purchased it in January 2009 with 44,000 miles. He is extremely meticulous with everything he owns and has kept the car in pristine condition. It is immaculate inside and out. You can literally eat off the door sills....but don't do that as the car has never been eaten in.

Here are the specs:

2004 330i Sedan w/ ZHP Performance Package
6-speed manual transmission
Alpine White exterior
Black Alcantara/Cloth with Black Cube Interior
63,000 miles
Serviced personally by the owner since purchase in 1/2009. Service records at BMW dealer by original owner for prior services.
Front/Rear Bridgestone Potenza RE-11 tires with good life left.
No accidents, original everything.


And the bad:
Minor curbing on the wheels from the original owner
Cosmetic scratches on interior plastics around the e-brake from the original owner's finger nails.
The car has a Manufacture Buyback Title. We researched it when he purchased the car. Speaking with the dealer who sold and serviced the car to the original owner they explained that there was a reoccurring issue with the memory module in the side view mirrors. He has owned the car since 2009 and has had no issues with the mirrors, or the car, since purchasing it. I am confident that the car is mechanically sound I just have concerns over the title's impact on the resale value.

I'm eager for your thoughts...

http://thesemite.com/gallery3/var/resizes/otherpeople/ben/Random/bmw/front%20quarter.jpg?m=1305657368
http://thesemite.com/gallery3/var/resizes/otherpeople/ben/Random/bmw/DSC_0266.jpg?m=1305656289
http://thesemite.com/gallery3/var/resizes/otherpeople/ben/Random/bmw/interior.jpg?m=1305654832

Oh my dear lord, you need to jump on that!

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Let me just tell you what I'd pay for the brandless car. I think it would be fairly priced at around $18,000. Alpine white is rare. We hardly see them in the wild. :biggrin

The branded title, though, makes it a lot more difficult to price this thing. If you buy this car, you'll want to get a discount on it. Why? Because if you ever resell it, you're going will have to explain the branded title as well. People hate stories. Stories depreciate the car. How much, though? That's like asking how ugly someone is. Every person will have a different opinion.

I can't tell you how much to offer for this car. But I can tell you this: figure out how easy (or difficult) you think it will be to resell it when it's your turn. Maybe factor in how much you think you'd have to discount it a few years from now. Make that a starting point for yourself.

It's a nice looking car, though. Good luck with whatever you do.

[danewilson77]

That AW....is "the one"

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

[Chernobyl Prize]

Title issues have been the bane of my existence since I began my ZHP hunt. 80% of the ZHP ads are salvage or convertibles (lol dealers can't move the verts).

[Marcus-SanDiego]

CP, I kept running into wrecks during my search. Worse, many of the sellers didn't disclose these accidents. Instead, I found them through AutoCheck (http://www.dpbolvw.net/click-4193730-10857687). I really started disliking sellers toward the end of the process.

[Chernobyl Prize]

That's why I'm here, I'll post the goodies and spare everyone the horror listings while I search for my ZHP.

[WilC]

Hello Guys,

I'm in the process of buying this ZHP: http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=p&car_id=301495808&dealer_id=66365005&doors=Four+Door&start_year=2004&advanced=y&transmission=Manual&make=BMW&model=330I&body_style=SEDAN&search_type=used&distance=0&end_year=2005&address=08902&seller_type=b

Is there someone from the forum in Jackson, MS who can take a look a this car for me and let me know the overall condition?

EDIT: I got the Carfax and is clean, he is the 3rd. owner and had the car for 2.5 years. Only flaws are a few dings, curb rash on the wheels, and I small crack on the windshield. My biggest concernt in flood damage since it is in MS.

Thanks,

Wil

[pleasecorrupt]

Assuming everything checks out, price is more than reasonable and the color combo is to die for.

[danewilson77]

:drool

Buy it for the Aluminum trim alone.....hehe

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Looks good. Price is realistic.

[WilC]

I probably won't be able to make the trip to MS, do you think buying a car w/o driving it or even seeing it in person is a bad idea?

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Generally speaking, I think it's risky.

When I bought my car I agreed to the deal before I saw it in person. However, I did see it the next day -- in person. Only after I laid my own eyes on it did I agree and hand over cash.

I would not like the idea of buying a car without having someone (if it's not you) put some eyes on it.

[WilC]

Generally speaking, I think it's risky.

When I bought my car I agreed to the deal before I saw it in person. However, I did see it the next day -- in person. Only after I laid my own eyes on it did I agree and hand over cash.

Good point. When I bought my 318i, I also agreed on the deal before I saw the car but I did the purchase in person.

I will do the same if there is a deal.... Thx all for your suggestions.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Wil, I think that's a good idea. Good call.

[Chernobyl Prize]

I got an inspection today on this ZHP: http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?ff3=4&pub=5574947307&toolid=10001&campid=5336776893&customid=&mpre=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com%2Febaymotors%2FM-PERFORMANCE-PACKAGE-LEATHER-MOON-IMMACULATE-M3-%2F250836114187%3Fpt%3DUS_Cars_Trucks%26hash%3Dite m3a66ff5b0b

I appreciate everyone's input as there are two troubling pictures:

What am I seeing here?
http://www.dsfs.com/photos//1309/1/3969460/3969460_0047.jpg


And how bad is this?
http://www.dsfs.com/photos//1309/1/3969460/3969460_0043.jpg

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Can't click through to the ebay link.

[Chernobyl Prize]

Sorry, here you go: http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?ff3=4&pub=5574947307&toolid=10001&campid=5336776893&customid=&mpre=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com%2Febaymotors%2FM-PERFORMANCE-PACKAGE-LEATHER-MOON-IMMACULATE-M3-%2F250836114187%3Fpt%3DUS_Cars_Trucks%26hash%3Dite m3a66ff5b0b

[aurelius]

I probably won't be able to make the trip to MS, do you think buying a car w/o driving it or even seeing it in person is a bad idea?

But you would still have a PPI (pre-purchase inspection) done, correct? See http://www.bimmershops.com/

[danewilson77]

I got an inspection today on this ZHP: http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?ff3=4&pub=5574947307&toolid=10001&campid=5336776893&customid=&mpre=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com%2Febaymotors%2FM-PERFORMANCE-PACKAGE-LEATHER-MOON-IMMACULATE-M3-%2F250836114187%3Fpt%3DUS_Cars_Trucks%26hash%3Dite m3a66ff5b0b

I appreciate everyone's input as there are two troubling pictures:

What am I seeing here?
http://www.dsfs.com/photos//1309/1/3969460/3969460_0047.jpg


And how bad is this?
http://www.dsfs.com/photos//1309/1/3969460/3969460_0043.jpg

Looks like the window is cracked/scratched.....and the window seal is shot.

[Oli77]

do you think buying a car w/o driving it or even seeing it in person is a bad idea?

You bosses considered setting up a sub-forum for helping forum members looking/ driving cars of interest in a geographical area yet? ;)

[Chernobyl Prize]

Turns out it's not a crack the tint has a crease there. The tint is coming off anyway so that's good. Is replacing the window seal difficult/expensive?

[danewilson77]

You bosses considered setting up a sub-forum for helping forum members looking/ driving cars of interest in a geographical area yet? ;)

I would just start a thread....then we can stick it. Doesn't need an entire subforum.

Or...start the thread in regionals.....

[llll1l1ll]

Hey all,

I came across this ad on craigslist: http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/cto/2433487084.html.

I've spoken to the seller and I'm a bit wary. He says he's owned it since late 2005. The first two years were covered under the manufacturer warranty, and then the second two were covered under the CPO warranty. He says nothing has gone wrong within those years under the CPO warranty. He apparently is in the process of getting records for another potential buyer. He's always had the oil changed at BMW when it was free; however, once it was no longer free he refused to be overcharged for "a stupid oil change" and started going to Jiffy Lube. I know how Jiffy Lube's in NC are - I used to work at one. On the other hand, he has been getting the Mobil 1 service at Jiffy Lube.

He took it to BMW a few months ago when it last snowed big (so probably in Feb. for those familiar with this area). He said that the technicians recommended control arm bushings, belts/hoses/seals that tend to go wrong at this age of the car, and some tires. He says they indicated one of the wheels was bent. He opted not to get any of these services done at that point in time; however, he has factored in the cost of new front tires and the bent wheel into the cost of the car. He was willing to give me a free Carfax, but he spoiled the ending and told me that it would come up with straight-As, haha.

Otherwise, this car seems legit. Although I'm not hot-to-trot on a black car, as I would prefer a red or gray one, it does have alcantara, an aux input and xenons.

Sorry for the novel. What do you guys think? I'm considering going to take a look after my initial refusal, as even he said it's worth it to take a peek.

Oh, and Seller, if you are on here, sorry for posting this, haha. I mean you no harm whatsoever, I am merely obtaining a second opinion and wish you the best of luck.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Some times I get a feeling about a car. I'll only tell you what I'd do with this one. I would pass. This is a BMW. Maintenance is not cheap. My biggest fear about a place like Jiffy Lube isn't that they will use inferior oil. Instead, I worry that they'll use inferior filters.

Another thing. If you're going to make an exception on a car color, make it on a car that sparkles in every other area. This car doesn't inspire me.

Me? I'd pass. Find the car you really want. Don't settle.

[llll1l1ll]

That's what I was thinking, since I'd like to get into a car that doesn't immediately need around 900 in repairs (two new front tires and CABs).

[nickershocker]

If you get more interested in this car, you need to buy it for the right price. In great condition the price might be $15.8k (IMO). Start subtracting from there. It sounds like it needs about $1500-$2000 in work if done by mechanic if BMW caught everything. Assume they didn't (+25%) takes us to $2500. Add in a headache factor if getting the work done is a headache for you = Offer no more than $13k (IMO, after PPI comes back w/in the realm of estimated work needed).

Or wait... A better ZHP will come around if you can be patient. (Of course Marcus is spot on. If you are having iffy feelings, then pass.)

[nickershocker]

I might be a little heavy on my estimate, but you certainly would rather be heavy than light.

[llll1l1ll]

Well, I have tons of patience as I Metro to work. This is the first car that I have found so far, and it's generally not a good idea to jump on the first one unless you are absolutely, positively sure. I was considering looking at it to get an example of what to watch out for, but I don't want to kick the guy's tires and waste his time.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

I agree with Nickershocker's (is it Nick?) comments. I do the same thing. I start figuring out what it will cost me to get the car to where it needs to be. I deduct it from the price of the car.

And I think that's cool of you to not waste the guy's time. Give him a call. Tell him what your thought process is on this car. I have to do all of this work, the maintenance issues worries me, etc. I'd offer no more than $13,500. Therefore, unless you're willing to take that price, I don't want to come over to your place and waste your time kicking tires on a car that I won't buy.

I'd appreciate that a lot more than having someone come by on a Saturday when the guy has no interest in buying it.

[llll1l1ll]

I mean, plus I already have declined to see it and he's wanting to know why. I'm not going to chew him apart or anything. He's been really helpful on his end by already telling me what is most likely wrong on the car.

Thanks for the help! I knew joining this forum was a good idea.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

We do our best to help each other out. We're glad you joined too.

[zj96sc]

Looking for some input on the value of this one....

basics:
2003 ZHP 6MT Sedan Silver Gray
alcantara, silver cube, heated seats, navi, HK, sunroof
124,000 miles, full documented maintenance history
alcantara wheel replaced with M tri-stitch

bad:
front bumper replaced with oem due to parking space curb backstop incident (he says, pics looked worse)
possibly sideswiped on interstate (found a passing reference in the seller's previous posts about someone changing lanes into him on the interstate and waiting for the car to get back from the body shop..no mention in FS post)
dead pixels in navi
loose passenger rear door trim
flickering passenger headlight (he says loose connection)
wrong gauge cluster (6500RPM redline) he says the previous owner had the cluster replaced under warranty and didn't notice the redline diff.
curbed front wheels, at least 1 rear wheel replaced due to dents (again found by digging around seller's previous forum posts)

mods:
ceramic pads
active exhaust & ECU
gruppe M intake
adjustable konis
painted moldings (job quality unknown)


With that mileage she bluebooks at $11,6 ex $10,9 good. I know bluebook isn't exactly always a great litmus for ZHPs....

Seller is in the process of getting 20-30 photos for me to get a more solid idea of the condition. Car is 1k miles away so photos, carfax/autocheck, and PPI will have to give me the complete story before I make the trip.

So what say ye, mafia? The mods are tasteful, but even in light of that my gut feeling is that given the problems and possible history of paint/bodywork I wouldn't even want to give KBB Good.

Thanks!
Paul

[danewilson77]

What is your budget? If you say $15k or >.....pass.

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

[zj96sc]

I would be willing to pay ~20 for the right low mileage example, but I've been searching in various degrees of seriousness since July '10. This is literally the first silver gray sedan on alcanatara with heated seats and navi that I've found. Just not sure if I want to take the possible negatives or hold out on the hopes of finding a better example.

[Chernobyl Prize]

Its sounds wore out and beat up. You've got the budget to get something much better if you're patient.

[danewilson77]

Just "walk away"

[Marcus-SanDiego]

zj, pass.

[MAS]

Ok how about this one?

Asking price: $14,950
2005 330i ~85k miles
Blue exterior, black alcantara interior with black cube trim
Clean Carfax and title

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/jpw3578/DSC06386.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/jpw3578/DSC06390.jpg

Is the price too high based on the mileage?

[Marcus-SanDiego]

It's more than I would pay based on mileage. Maybe $13K?

[MAS]

It's more than I would pay based on mileage. Maybe $13K?

Thats what I was thinking. The seller is trying to say that it is already priced 4k below kbb, and since they know its a zhp they are trying to give me the "its so rare" premium markup. I hate negotiating lol

[Marcus-SanDiego]

I love negotiating. :biggrin

I mostly love it because I always know there will be yet another "thing" down the road. I find my price and stick with it.

[danewilson77]

Ok how about this one?

Asking price: $14,950
2005 330i ~85k miles
Blue exterior, black alcantara interior with black cube trim
Clean Carfax and title

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/jpw3578/DSC06386.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v234/jpw3578/DSC06390.jpg

Is the price too high based on the mileage?

East or West coast.

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

[MAS]

east coast

[danewilson77]

east coast

I think its priced pretty fair...imho.

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

[Marcus-SanDiego]

East coast tends to get higher prices. I'd still be looking to pay $13K. Easy for me to say, though, since I live on the west coast.

[BimmerRules!]

Came across this listing in the east coast - '04, 115k, stick, $14k:

http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/cto/2446136149.html

Wonder what the experts think about the many things replaced by the current owner with OEM parts (see below).

=====================

* Shifter bearings, washers, selector guide (no shifter movement/freeplay)
* Both rear diff side seals and pinion seal
* All four window regulators
* Xenon control module
* Water pump
* Thermostat
* Expansion Tank
* Lower Rad hose with temp sensor
* DSSA Valve
* Crankcase Oil Separator (upgraded cold kit) with new dipstick tube
* Drive Belts
* Starter
*Power steering pump
* Power steering lines (including the really expensive pressure line)
* Complete oil filter housing with new gasket
* Updated hydraulic belt tensioner kit
* Both rear tailight bulb carriers with updated wiring kit
* (Previous Owner) CD Player/Radio I have Ipod Iphone kit, So you can listen to your music.
* (Previous Owner) Ignition Coil recall performed
* Both control arm bushings
* Akebono Euro Ceramic brake pads at all four corners
* New OEM front rotors
Aside from an OEM BMW Performance shift knob and Akebono brake pads (no dust), this vehicle is COMPLETELY STOCK
================
http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/cto/2446136149.html

[BCS_ZHP]

Everything he lists are known areas where E46s may need attention. Coolant system at about 100K miles, belts every 60K miles, mechanical tensioners squealed most replaced with hydraulic, brakes are just a consumable, front control arm bushings every 50-60K miles, window regulators just go out sometimes for no reason, earlier cars had some rear taillight wiring problems, I've done the shifter bearings on non-ZHP with less than 90K miles, same for the oil filter housing it just started leaking, power steering pumps will fail if you don't flush the system regularly -- it sounds like he's tended to everything that might need it.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

I agree. Looks like all of the problem areas have been dealt with. The only problem I have is this: a ZHP with 115K miles should not fetch $14K.

[BimmerRules!]

Everything he lists are known areas where E46s may need attention. Coolant system at about 100K miles, belts every 60K miles, mechanical tensioners squealed most replaced with hydraulic, brakes are just a consumable, front control arm bushings every 50-60K miles, window regulators just go out sometimes for no reason, earlier cars had some rear taillight wiring problems, I've done the shifter bearings on non-ZHP with less than 90K miles, same for the oil filter housing it just started leaking, power steering pumps will fail if you don't flush the system regularly -- it sounds like he's tended to everything that might need it.

Thank you. He also mentions that he's a mechanic and that the work was done by a BMW certified tech.

Question on clutches: how long to they last in cars like these that have been driven hard?

[Marcus-SanDiego]

I always figure that most prices are negotiable.

[BimmerRules!]

I agree. Looks like all of the problem areas have been dealt with. The only problem I have is this: a ZHP with 115K miles should not fetch $14K.

He mentions OBO in the ad. So, interested parties have some room for negotiation.

Heck, maybe I should consider this as this would be my first manual here in the US and for a relatively low $, might help me decide if sticks are indeed the way to go. Hmm... :)

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Yep. Just work that price down. I think the steal of June was Rich's ZHP, (http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?3219-For-Sale-2003-E46-BMW-330i-6MT-4-Door-Sedan-Silver-Gray-105K-miles-1-Owner-Orlando-FL-9-900) which sold for $9900. Had 105,000 miles on it.

[BimmerRules!]

Oh wow! I just browsed that thread on Rich's zhp and was shocked to see that low a price for a single-owner car that's been so well maintained. Wonder why he didn't quote higher and leave room for negotiation. It's moot now, but a great reference for the buyers! Thanks for the link Marcus! :)

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Not really sure why he priced it at less than $10K. My guess is that he wanted to move it fast. That price did the trick. Sold in about 12 hours.

The new owner is a ZHPMafia.com member. So, it's staying in the family.

[BimmerRules!]

btw, apologies Marcus. I didn't realize that the '04 red 115k miles zhp (Westbury, NY) craigslist listing that I referred to earlier in this thread is already present under the 2004 vintage FS listing. But, good to know the feedback from the experts. :)

[Marcus-SanDiego]

BR, absolutely no worries. I appreciate the help around here.

[knosker]

I was wondering what my car is worth and what it would realistically sell for. It's a 2004 330CI ZHP with premium, cold weather package, leather seats, navigation, black, 6-speed manual, no sunroof. The exterior has a few scratches and the interior is in very good condition. The car does have 160,000 miles, nearly all highway. I can't post pics yet but will try to asap. The car was in an accident in 2006 but was repaired professionally, it looks great now. Nothing is wrong with it. How much do you think it would fetch?

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Difficult to know, Knosker. My best guess, with the accident, is that you'd get about $7,500-$8,000 for it. By the way, I think the mileage devalues the car more than the accident at this point. When you start getting high mileage, the accident doesn't have the same impact that it would if the car had, say, 30,000 miles on it.

Anyhow, if you are interested in selling it, find out what the blue book price is on it -- without the accident. Then, once you have that number, factor in a small discount for the accident. See what you come up with.

[zj96sc]

Looking for some input on the value of this one....

basics:
2003 ZHP 6MT Sedan Silver Gray.................


http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?374-E46-BMW-330-ZHP-Buyers-Corner-Is-it-a-good-deal&p=72076#post72076

Got more details on recent maintenance.... cooling system overhauled, FCABS done, crank case vent, steering coupler, tranny and diff w/ redline, flushed brake fluid, shocks new (konis), upper shock mounts front and upgraded upper shock mounts rear, plugs and valve cover gasket, oil filter housing gasket, all new headlight housings + lenses + controllers (fog lenses too) (burned bowls turned into full swap), oil changed every 7.5k w/ mobil 1 0-40. Records for everything. Actually selling because he's taken a job in another country.

I got the pictures on this car, plus a startup video. Aside from some small nicks in the rear bumper and the dead navi pixels, there is almost nothing visibly wrong with the car. Painted moldings look good. Seats + bolsters in good shape. M-tri-stitch wheel looks great.

As far as the sideswipe, he claims paintwork ONLY, no body work was done. Says it was a very minor impact. I, of course, have no way of verifying the truth of this statement, but he has been upfront and honest with any questions I've asked thus far. In reality, properly repaired body damage isn't something to scare me off, provided it was repaired well and is reflected in the price.

Considering my budget, this car would be a cash purchase. To up to my "full" budget of ~20 would mean a small loan. I can have this car and not assume any debt, which would be nice.

Carfax and autocheck are squeaky clean. It picked up ~50,000 miles in the first two years. Standard yearly mileage since then.

Against the mafia's recommendations.................What would you guys pay for this car for it to be "worth it" ?

[Marcus-SanDiego]

zj, I don't think I'd buy this at any price. Why? Because, with my budget being as high as $20K, I would not want to settle for something like this. There are too many nice ZHPs between $15K-$20K.

If I did get it for a particular price that I could not refuse, I would pick it up and then flip it. I would not own this one. That's me, though.

[zj96sc]

So what's that refusal price for you? Sub 10k?

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Probably between $6K-$7K. I'm keying off Rich's ZHP that just sold for $9900. It had 105,000 miles on it. All maintenance current. No accidents. No stories.

Note that this is the price I wouldn't refuse. Not saying you shouldn't pay more. Just saying I'd buy it at that price and flip it.

Fact is, I'm not interested in this car. So, I would have the luxury of setting a price and sticking with it.

[zj96sc]

technology fail. tried to edit that post.

I had an E36 M for a while that a similar tale of the tape. 110,000 miles but documented, multiple owners, history of minor bodywork. Ended up being a great car that really held value for me.

I'm not sure what to think or do. This car is going to be a daily pounder for me and I commute almost 50 round trip. I'm going to rack miles on it fast, so I don't know if there is a ton of logic in picking up a cherry 40,000 mile $20,000 example just to mile it up too.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Hmmm. Well, if you plan on driving the piss out of it, I don't think I'd want a low-mileage queen either.

Decisions, decisions. I'd be torn, too.

[danewilson77]

There are too many nice ZHPs between $15K-$20K.

Truuuuuuuf.

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

[zj96sc]

Alright...another one for ya!

2005, 330i, silvergray, black leather, sunroof, cold wx. 89k miles. clear corners but all amber OEM plastic included. alcantara wheel replaced with a leather M wheel by BMW. handful of small dings, chips on the nose, minor rash on the underside of the right front splitter.

paperwork for all mx work under this owner (2nd owner). Bought CPO, CPO until Jan of this year.

clean history, clean carfax and autocheck. brand new tires. body color moulding. offering a set of CSL reps in addition to the stockers for another +$1k.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

How much does the seller want for it?

[///mattleegeee]

(First time poster, looking to get a ZHP)

Is this a good deal? Im kind of set on getting a Alpine White...

2004 Mystic Blue ZHP, 6spd, alcantara interior, Harmon Kardon Sound, Clean Title, with 73k on it. Has H&R Cup kit, and the windows are tinted (previous owner). Have all maintenance records and hisotry from BMW asking $16.5k
West coast

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Matt, that sounds reasonable. I'm assuming the paint looks good. Is this a private seller or dealer?

[///mattleegeee]

private party, i actually have a wanted ad up on craigslist and he responded to that
he is sending pictures today, i dont think he had it up for sale but maybe saw my ad

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Matt, ahh. Cool. All prices are negotiable. Do your best to get the best price for yourself.

[danewilson77]

(First time poster, looking to get a ZHP)

Is this a good deal? Im kind of set on getting a Alpine White...

2004 Mystic Blue ZHP, 6spd, alcantara interior, Harmon Kardon Sound, Clean Title, with 73k on it. Has H&R Cup kit, and the windows are tinted (previous owner). Have all maintenance records and hisotry from BMW asking $16.5k
West coast

Matt....welcome to the forum. For a Westie....I might start around $15k on that one

Droid + Tapatalk = FTW!

[///mattleegeee]

thanks dane and marcus
once i get some pics i will shoot him that offer depending on how it drives and looks in person

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Good luck with everything.

[llll1l1ll]

I've been talking to a seller, and I want to know if this sounds sketch to you guys:

He has owned the car for a year, has had the car serviced at BMW; however, he does not know the last time the cooling system was replaced or the CABs were replaced. On the other hand, he has not noticed any hesitation in the 2,800 rpm range. In response to only owning it for a year, he said that although it's a good driver's car, his wife's work has a deal with Mercedes and they can get a better deal on a Merc through them. Thus, they are ditching the ZHP. Price is 17,500 and it has 69K on the clock. Looks nice.

I don't think that sounds all that sketch, but my girlfriend felt that was somewhat sketchy. Whatchu guys think?

[danewilson77]

I'm not feeling sketch at all.

[zj96sc]

How much does the seller want for it?

he's asking 17, 18 with the CSL reps.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

he's asking 17, 18 with the CSL reps.

I would not pay $17K for a ZHP with 90K miles.

$14K would be my offer. In that area. See this one, which sold just yesterday (for $14K and same miles). http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?3438-For-Sale-%28SOLD%29-2003-BMW-330i-ZHP-Silver-Gray-Blk-Leather-6sp-90k-mi-15.5k-Socal

[Marcus-SanDiego]

I've been talking to a seller, and I want to know if this sounds sketch to you guys:

He has owned the car for a year, has had the car serviced at BMW; however, he does not know the last time the cooling system was replaced or the CABs were replaced. On the other hand, he has not noticed any hesitation in the 2,800 rpm range. In response to only owning it for a year, he said that although it's a good driver's car, his wife's work has a deal with Mercedes and they can get a better deal on a Merc through them. Thus, they are ditching the ZHP. Price is 17,500 and it has 69K on the clock. Looks nice.

I don't think that sounds all that sketch, but my girlfriend felt that was somewhat sketchy. Whatchu guys think?

Seems plausible to me. My sketch alert is not on (says a former journalist and investigative reporter).

[llll1l1ll]

FWIW, my girlfriend doesn't know much about cars. The seller seems legit. I bet I could knock the price down some if I don't accept the set of snow tires and wheels that comes with the car. It doesn't snow that much here in MD, and I wouldn't drive it in the snow, anyway. Too low to the ground.

[aurelius]

2004 Mystic Blue ZHP, 6spd, alcantara interior, Harmon Kardon Sound, Clean Title, with 73k on it. Has H&R Cup kit, and the windows are tinted (previous owner). Have all maintenance records and hisotry from BMW asking $16.5k
West coast

Verify service history. Avoid the "oh, the dealer has all the records" scenario. The dealer will not give you those past records unless you were the owner of the car at time of service. Have seller get re-prints if necessary.

At that mileage, make a list and check it twice. Budget for most if not all of the E46 issues & expected maintenance stuff. None of which is horribly expensive if you source the parts properly and DIY. All of which is horribly expensive if you do not. Ignoring the usual suspects in the cooling system can and will destroy the motor.

^^^not to scare you away. Just be smart about the little things that can turn real big, real fast.

Also, as I've posted in other threads:

"always dealer serviced" is a common descriptor in BMW for sale ads. The translation of which, unfortunately, is that virtually no preventive maintenance was ever performed. Even when brought in for a repair of some sort under warranty, customer has to request service items and most owners do not know -- while under warranty -- you can claim a free annual motor oil change even if you never drove the car at all, not to mention a brake flush at 2 years and a coolant flush at 3 years. Intervals being from date of manufacture. Therefore and even without an ext'd service contract, any late model BMW was at one time eligible for 4 oil changes, 2 brake fluid flushes, and one coolant flush. But very rare is the car which actually received such service.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Good points, Mark.

My previous owner provided service records to me (because he got them when he still owned the car). It's simple as pie.

I noticed in the service records that the previous owner got low-mileage oil changes (says exactly that: annual low mileage oil service).

[aurelius]

He has owned the car for a year, has had the car serviced at BMW; however, he does not know the last time the cooling system was replaced or the CABs were replaced. On the other hand, he has not noticed any hesitation in the 2,800 rpm range. In response to only owning it for a year, he said that although it's a good driver's car, his wife's work has a deal with Mercedes and they can get a better deal on a Merc through them. Thus, they are ditching the ZHP. Price is 17,500 and it has 69K on the clock. Looks nice.

I don't think that sounds all that sketch, but my girlfriend felt that was somewhat sketchy. Whatchu guys think?

Given the mileage, my post above would apply to this car too. Again, do your research and budget accordingly. Avoid surprises and have a PPI done at your behest (ie you choose the shop, you pay for it, the shop answers to you, etc.).

As for the one year of ownership, the reasons for that could be many but don't rule out "owner took it into BMW dealership service dept and was quoted $17 million to replace all the usual E46 suspects. Whereby owner became seller."

Pay attn to the tires and whether the windows go up & down without clicking & clacking.

Reminds me once again we need a ZHP Buyer Checklist sticky to which we can link potential buyers..........it's in rough form but I have 2 or 3 lists I could merge to get that started. For anyone interested, feel free to PM for my cooling system rehab cheat sheet.

Meantime, 2 thumbs up for Dane's stickies at the top of the Maintenance forum.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Mark, if you'd like to take a shot at that buyer's checklist, that would be great. Would make a great sticky.

[llll1l1ll]

Yeah, that's why I thought this was sketch was because he probably saw what the repair bill would be.

I'm good at sourcing parts and DIY thanks to my E30.

Thanks for the help, Mafia.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Thanks for the help, Mafia.

You're welcome, sir.

[aurelius]

I'm good at sourcing parts and DIY thanks to my E30.

Bro, if you have an e30 and are even somewhat handy, you're well primed for e46 ownership. The e46, altho more crap to go wrong, is almost always a lot easier to work on.

I just crawled out of the trunk of one of my e30's. Changing out RSM's. Had the trunk lined with a tempur pedic seat pad. Perfect dog bed.

[billschusteriv]

Bro, if you have an e30 and are even somewhat handy, you're well primed for e46 ownership. The e46, altho more crap to go wrong, is almost always a lot easier to work on.

I just crawled out of the trunk of one of my e30's. Changing out RSM's. Had the trunk lined with a tempur pedic seat pad. Perfect dog bed.

:rofl

[llll1l1ll]

Yeah, I was comparing the engine bay of the E30 vs. the E46. Seems a lot less cramped in the E46. Water pump replacement seems a lot easier, as well. I've owned the E30 for almost seven years now and it's been easy to work on - just cramped. And very oily.

[///mattleegeee]

Here is an update with pictures, it looks pretty clean. Thinking about meeting up with him this weekend to see it in person

http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i313/mattleegee/Taco/IMG_4919.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i313/mattleegee/Taco/IMG_48821.jpg
http://i75.photobucket.com/albums/i313/mattleegee/Taco/IMG_4040.jpg

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Matt, that looks good. Let us know how it turns out.

[WilC]

Hello, is me again. I found this ZHP in the Texas area and it seems pretty clean. The dealer told me it has a small dent on the rear quarter panel, passerger side and they can fix it for $250 on top of the agreed price. Also, it is missing the spoiler, was this an option on ZHPs, I thought it was part of the ZHP pkg.?

What do you guys/gals think?
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=301903529&dealer_id=585208&car_year=2005&systime=&doors=&model=330I&search_lang=en&start_year=2005&keywordsfyc=&keywordsrep=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=used&distance=0&min_price=&rdm=1308833265092&drive=&marketZipError=false&advanced=y&fuel=&keywords_display=&sownerid=73838&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2006&showZipError=n&color3=&make2=&certified=&engine=&dma=NEW_YORK_NJ&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=0&transmission=Manual&default_sort=&max_mileage=&color=WHITE&address=08902&sort_type=priceDESC&max_price=&color2=SILVER&make=BMW&seller_type=b&num_records=25&cardist=1334&standard=false&rdpage=thumb

[aurelius]

Hello, is me again. I found this ZHP in the Texas area and it seems pretty clean. The dealer told me it has a small dent on the rear quarter panel, passerger side and they can fix it for $250 on top of the agreed price. Also, it is missing the spoiler, was this an option on ZHPs, I thought it was part of the ZHP pkg.?

What do you guys/gals think?
http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=u&car_id=301903529&dealer_id=585208&car_year=2005&systime=&doors=&model=330I&search_lang=en&start_year=2005&keywordsfyc=&keywordsrep=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=used&distance=0&min_price=&rdm=1308833265092&drive=&marketZipError=false&advanced=y&fuel=&keywords_display=&sownerid=73838&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2006&showZipError=n&color3=&make2=&certified=&engine=&dma=NEW_YORK_NJ&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=0&transmission=Manual&default_sort=&max_mileage=&color=WHITE&address=08902&sort_type=priceDESC&max_price=&color2=SILVER&make=BMW&seller_type=b&num_records=25&cardist=1334&standard=false&rdpage=thumb

Looks ok. Expect all the usual E46 service needs at that mileage and budget accordingly. Given the known cooling system failure points, I would not drive that car home to wherever you live w/o doing various things and thoroughly checking others (unless it can be shown these have already been done).

Some ZHP sedans lack the trunk spoiler. Rumor has it there was a production shortage at one point. It is also rumored some have gotten BMW to paint & install on a goodwill basis but that kind of thing is usually reserved for original owners and or when the car is still very new. Worth asking but I wouldn't count on it.

I am in Dallas and if you or anyone else out there become serious about this car, I will go check it out and can recommend my Autologic-equipped indie mechanic for a PPI. Preferably these 2 things would be done at the same time. Two birds, one stone, etc.

[Serious about the car = you are ready, willing, & able to buy, don't need a month to sell your current vehicle, you like the color combo, transmission, & options it has, and can live with the options it does not have.]

I am not familiar with this particular seller, there are literally hundreds of independent used car dealers in the DFW area. It is a safe bet they have no service records and only one key. Inquire accordingly.

FYI, it's also on eBay as a "BIN or make an offer" (ie non-auction) listing.

[WilC]

Aurelius, Thanks for your comments and offering your services. If I decide to take you up on it, I will PM you.

PS: Why do I like this forum better than the e46fanatics site? Because of the people.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Wil, regarding the trunk spoiler, definitely read this (our FAQ): http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?1789-Frequently-Asked-Questions-%28FAQ%29-About-the-BMW-E46-330-ZHP-Performance-Package-Option

There was definitely a shortage of parts in early 2004. However, you are looking at a 2005 car, so the owner likely did a delete (instead of getting shorted). You can confirm that by getting a list of the original options on the car (code 326 is the trunk lid spoiler delete).

Anyhow, the FAQ is chock full of useful information.

[zj96sc]

Looking for some input on the value of this one....

basics:
2003 ZHP 6MT Sedan Silver Gray
alcantara, silver cube, heated seats, navi, HK, sunroof
124,000 miles, full documented maintenance history
alcantara wheel replaced with M tri-stitch


I had this car PPI'ed. Codes for cat efficiency, MAF, 6 stored light codes, 3 bent wheels, 1 welded wheel, filthy brake fluid, dirty oil, belts "like chalk", and cracked plastic panels underneath.

Looks like the ZHP mafia was dead on on this one. Guess I should've known! ;)

[Marcus-SanDiego]

I had this car PPI'ed. Codes for cat efficiency, MAF, 6 stored light codes, 3 bent wheels, 1 welded wheel, filthy brake fluid, dirty oil, belts "like chalk", and cracked plastic panels underneath.

Looks like the ZHP mafia was dead on on this one. Guess I should've known! ;)

That's the one that I said I'd pay $6K-$7K for? Sounds like a bucket. After seeing all that stuff, I would not pay any price for it.

[zj96sc]

That's the one. Yeah, pretty rough results for a car with "full documented maintenance history."

Ah well. Back to hunt mode.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Back to the hunt.

[ecrabb]

What do you guys think of this one?

http://kansascity.craigslist.org/cto/2455483318.html

Seller is a retired dealer buying and selling part-time. Chatted with him on the phone and he said he cherry-picks and re-sells nice cars in his spare time; got this one from the local Infiniti dealer's trade stock. No maintenance history available other than carfax/autocheck and whatever a dealer could provide. He said it's in very nice shape other than some door dings and missing the fog lights. He said the only thing he did to it was fixed the moonroof shade clips and "something with the front brakes" (so I don't know if that was pads or pads and rotors).

My instinct (if I were to try to buy this car) would be to buy the car for a lot less (assuming it passed a PPI). That would leave some money in the kitty for cooling system, VANOS, and a few other things that undoubtedly need attention. My total budget is close to $15k, but the less the better. Of course, the lower the mileage, the better.

He said his price is down at about what he could get at auction, and I tend to agree... OTOH, I'm not sure the car is worth that.

Thoughts?

Thanks!
SC

[danewilson77]

He prolly picked it up for $9k

Offer $10.5k.....after PPI check out. You want an auto?

[Marcus-SanDiego]

If you're following the old-school maintenance program, you're going to have some expenses coming up at 100,000 miles. This car is similar to mine that way (I bought a car that had an inspection II and preventive cooling overhaul coming soon). I'd also like to see meticulous records up to 100,000 miles. Unfortunately, your seller cannot provide those.

I'd think that this car, if properly maintained, should fetch about $11,000. The seller is already close to it. Seems like a fair price to me but it would not prevent me from trying to get the price down. I'd offer $10,500 and be willing to move to $11K.

Additionally, when I was looking for cars, I noticed that I could get cars at a better price if I was showing in the midwest. This is a midwest car. Not as many potential buyers in that region of the country.

[ecrabb]

He prolly picked it up for $9k

Offer $10.5k.....after PPI check out. You want an auto?
I agree on the pricing. No, I don't really want an auto - been driving boring SUVs too long and obsessed with the stick at the moment. But, A) sticks are obviously damn hard to come by - especially on less expensive cars - so since I live in the middle of nowhere, getting one is going to require a plane trip or paying to ship the car cross-country, and B) I'm a sucker for a deal.

I didn't talk price at all on the quick call I had with him, but based on some of his comments, I'm guessing he wouldn't move $1400 off his asking price. I think he dropped a couple grand off right before I found the ad. Not that it I wouldn't try to see what I could do if I really wanted the car...

Funny thing is, the car is about 3-1/2 hours away, but we're actually driving right through that area for the holiday weekend next weekend. I think I'll just play it cool, then on the off chance he hasn't sold the car, maybe re-engage with him middle of the week. It would give me extra bargaining room and I wouldn't be making special trip. I could see picking the car up, driving it for a 2-3 months, maybe doing the cooling system overhaul (because it's not expensive), learning my way around the car, seeing how I like it, then flipping it for a little more than I paid before the weather gets crappy and before I buy the car I really want. Just an idea.

Any idea what most techs typically get for a PPI or how hard it is to find somebody that knows these cars? Do the stealers do decent PPIs?

Thanks, guys!
SC

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Steve, a typical PPI should be $100-$150. A dealer likely charges its hourly rate times as many hours as they charge. I know that a Denver dealer was charging about $250 for a PPI.

After taxes, license, fees, plus your costs to get the car right, you probably would have a difficult time getting all of your money back. Unless you find a screaming deal, I'd stay away from the flipping game with these cars.

Just my two cents.

[ecrabb]

Excellent, thanks.


After taxes, license, fees, plus your costs to get the car right, you probably would have a difficult time getting all of your money back. Unless you find a screaming deal, I'd stay away from the flipping game with these cars.

Good point. I did consider that, but like I said, I wouldn't be flipping it to make money as much as just get to know the car before I buy "the one". That's also where my old man's dealer license comes in. ;) I could buy the car and drive it for a few months without paying any taxes or registration. Iowa is pretty cheap on vehicle registration even I had to put regular plates on it.

But, yeah - I definitely wouldn't do it to make money. If I bought it right, I could probably make a few hundred bucks (less the value of my time) and basically drive a free car for a few months and have a little experience with a car that wouldn't be my keeper. Just kickin' it around, though.

I imagine somebody will grab it at his asking price, anyway. At that price, a buyer is looking at either the ZHP, or something like a soulless fleet vehicle '08 or '09 Altima with 40- or 50k miles, a 4-banger, cloth interior, and steel 16" wheels with all-season radials. Which would you rather have? ;)

SC

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Steve, nice on that dealer license.

:chuck

[Freefallin2000]

I am brand new here but may have found the ZHP I want. I haven't sold my Mustang yet, but if it sells, in theory, this may be a very good choice for me. The ONLY thing that scares me is the mileage and potential repair cost, if any.

2004 330i ZHP, 83k, 2nd owner (he purchased with 5k in the clock), Silver/Gray interior w/black cube, 6spd
Asking $16,500 obo
All service done at local German shop
Zimmerman cross drilled rotors w/Cool Carbon pads
Cold air intake (cant remember name, something like APS or something?)
Powerflex poly front control arm bushings
Other than that, the car is factory with the exception of an all leather steering wheel instead of the Alcantara one.

What do you guys think a car like this is worth?

I will get some pictures up asap.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

I am moving this to the "E46 BMW 330 ZHP Buyers Corner -- Is it a good deal?" thread. You will get some answers there.

[Mike V]

I sold my 49k-mile 2005 for $17.6k but I probably let it go too cheap. The car went to a good friend, so I was willing to let it go a little cheaper.

If the previous owner has kept up on maintenance, $16.5k isn't too much of a stretch in today's used car market. If it was me looking, I wouldn't pay much more than $14k though. 83k miles is getting up there and lots of wear/tear items will need replacing soon. Has any preventive maintenance been done yet (cooling system, control arms, etc.)?

[llll1l1ll]

Hey all,

I came across this ad on craigslist: http://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/cto/2433487084.html.

I've spoken to the seller and I'm a bit wary. He says he's owned it since late 2005. The first two years were covered under the manufacturer warranty, and then the second two were covered under the CPO warranty. He says nothing has gone wrong within those years under the CPO warranty. He apparently is in the process of getting records for another potential buyer. He's always had the oil changed at BMW when it was free; however, once it was no longer free he refused to be overcharged for "a stupid oil change" and started going to Jiffy Lube. I know how Jiffy Lube's in NC are - I used to work at one. On the other hand, he has been getting the Mobil 1 service at Jiffy Lube.

He took it to BMW a few months ago when it last snowed big (so probably in Feb. for those familiar with this area). He said that the technicians recommended control arm bushings, belts/hoses/seals that tend to go wrong at this age of the car, and some tires. He says they indicated one of the wheels was bent. He opted not to get any of these services done at that point in time; however, he has factored in the cost of new front tires and the bent wheel into the cost of the car. He was willing to give me a free Carfax, but he spoiled the ending and told me that it would come up with straight-As, haha.

Otherwise, this car seems legit. Although I'm not hot-to-trot on a black car, as I would prefer a red or gray one, it does have alcantara, an aux input and xenons.

Sorry for the novel. What do you guys think? I'm considering going to take a look after my initial refusal, as even he said it's worth it to take a peek.

Oh, and Seller, if you are on here, sorry for posting this, haha. I mean you no harm whatsoever, I am merely obtaining a second opinion and wish you the best of luck.

Hi Mafia,

Hate to bring up old news, but the seller on this one contacted me again. Apparently, not many people have been biting/interested, so he offered to let it go for 13,700. He still has not addressed the aforementioned issues; however, at 13,700 I might be able to talk him a bit lower. Pics were grainy so I'd like to see the car in person. I figure at 13,xxx I can probably bring the car back up to speed for an extra 1,500.

For the record, the car has 77K on it.

Thanks in advance!

[Freefallin2000]

I sold my 49k-mile 2005 for $17.6k but I probably let it go too cheap. The car went to a good friend, so I was willing to let it go a little cheaper.

If the previous owner has kept up on maintenance, $16.5k isn't too much of a stretch in today's used car market. If it was me looking, I wouldn't pay much more than $14k though. 83k miles is getting up there and lots of wear/tear items will need replacing soon. Has any preventive maintenance been done yet (cooling system, control arms, etc.)?

As far as preventative maintenance, no, the cooling system has not been touched. I have heard several stories of cooling system needing to be replaced on these cars. What exactly will need to or should be replaced and how much am I looking at parts and labor at a local German Automotive shop?

The control arm bushings were replaced, as were the rotors and pads, but as far as I know, that is it. What else should I be worrying about when it comes to maintenance on ZHP package 330's? This is a very clean car, I just don't know if I can justify spending $16k on it. I would probably offer $14.5k if I was actually interested in purchasing after my car sold.

[aurelius]

As far as preventative maintenance, no, the cooling system has not been touched. I have heard several stories of cooling system needing to be replaced on these cars. What exactly will need to or should be replaced and how much am I looking at parts and labor at a local German Automotive shop?

What else should I be worrying about when it comes to maintenance on ZHP package 330's?

There has been discussion of assembling a ZHP buyer's checklist, which I more or less already have in rough form, spread across 3 documents. PM me if you want 'em and post any specific questions in the Maintenance forum.

Meantime, definitely budget for thorough cooling system replacement. At 83k mis, you may as well also do the radiator, which has a suggested replacement interval of 90k miles. Definitely replace it if car does not have proof of at least 2 coolant flushes since new.

As for cost, it can vary widely. Sourcing the parts well and going the DIY route is obviously cheapest and is not difficult in the case of the cooling system, especially on a E46 with a manual transmission. If you or a friend have a decent work space and some tools, you can do this. There are loads of online DIY tutorials.

For comparison, a relative's idler pulley failed recently and she was charged $450 by an indie shop to replace it plus the 2 belts and the tensioner pulley assembly (which was damaged when the belt broke due to idler pulley seizure). Sourced properly, the parts in question can be replaced for $120.

Definitely have a good indie German car repair shop lined up but short of DIY, another good way to save a lot of cash on basic maintenance is to find someone locally who does a little moonlighting on BMW repair. That way, you can still buy the parts you want and realize the savings there vs full retail (or more) for the parts when done at a shop.

[Freefallin2000]

There has been discussion of assembling a ZHP buyer's checklist, which I more or less already have in rough form, spread across 3 documents. PM me if you want 'em and post any specific questions in the Maintenance forum.

Meantime, definitely budget for thorough cooling system replacement. At 83k mis, you may as well also do the radiator, which has a suggested replacement interval of 90k miles. Definitely replace it if car does not have proof of at least 2 coolant flushes since new.

As for cost, it can vary widely. Sourcing the parts well and going the DIY route is obviously cheapest and is not difficult in the case of the cooling system, especially on a E46 with a manual transmission. If you or a friend have a decent work space and some tools, you can do this. There are loads of online DIY tutorials.

For comparison, a relative's idler pulley failed recently and she was charged $450 by an indie shop to replace it plus the 2 belts and the tensioner pulley assembly (which was damaged when the belt broke due to idler pulley seizure). Sourced properly, the parts in question can be replaced for $120.

Definitely have a good indie German car repair shop lined up but short of DIY, another good way to save a lot of cash on basic maintenance is to find someone locally who does a little moonlighting on BMW repair. That way, you can still buy the parts you want and realize the savings there vs full retail (or more) for the parts when done at a shop.

Well, a lot of good news. There is a shop dedicated to BMW repair only and this is the same shop that the owner has taken the car to since he has owned it. The service manager read all of the services done on the car. Window regulators, bad tail light ground, oil changes, coolant system flush, tranny flush, rear diff flush all about 20k ago, brakes, tires, front poly control arms bushings replaced, and I believe thermostat. It sounds like the guys drives it spirited at times, but judging by the service intervals and routine history of the services, he takes really good care of the car.

However, there is one draw back to this entire situation: My fiance will not let me get the car because A.), My Mustang is not sold yet B.) I would be getting only $8,500 or so for the Mustang so that means I would have to finance the rest of it which she is not OK with. According to my calculations, it would be roughly $190/month with all the money from my car going towards it. I am in a tough spot here because it's almost everything I want in a ZHP but I really don't have the funds to pay cash for it (not even clsoe actually lol).

Right now, it's looking like I am going to try to sell my car, take that money, save as much cash as I can and then buy one in cash, no financing. Don't get me wrong here boys, I do not enjoy financing anything. However, when nearly the perfect car is sitting right in front of my nose, what do I do!?

[///mattleegeee]

Im in the same spot free fallin, found one i want but am $4k short of buying it cash :( Got so much but just not enough to pay in cash

[aurelius]

Right now, it's looking like I am going to try to sell my car, take that money, save as much cash as I can and then buy one in cash, no financing. Don't get me wrong here boys, I do not enjoy financing anything. However, when nearly the perfect car is sitting right in front of my nose, what do I do!?

Congrats to you for wanting to pay cash. Put your car on craigslist or AT immediately and maybe you'll get lucky. Given the state of the used car market, you might be surprised and get a bit more than you think for your current car.

[zj96sc]

Depends on your self control; if you can realistically finance it over maybe 36 months with a competitive rate and a loan with no fees and prepayment penalties, and actually force yourself to pay it down ahead of schedule, your net financing cost may be a few hundred dollars, if that. You'll have to decide how much you trust yourself and if the few hundred bucks is worth the opportunity to jump on a car now.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Yep. The reality is that there are some excellent credit deals out there -- for well qualified buyers. I get offers (for used cars) from my credit unions (NASA and Pentagon) where the cost of capital is often less than 3% (just got a 2.99% offer from Pentagon).

When I got my 335 in 2009, BMW Financial was offering 0.9% financing. When a lender is allowing me to borrow cash at less than 1%, I am inclined to deploy my own cash in something that can outstrip the amount of financing that I'm paying.

Always analyze your own situation, though. We all have different credit scores and opportunities.

[tomjonesrocks]

Yep. The reality is that there are some excellent credit deals out there -- for well qualified buyers. I get offers (for used cars) from my credit unions (NASA and Pentagon) where the cost of capital is often less than 3% (just got a 2.99% offer from Pentagon).

Not trying to threadjack--but am very interested in the best place to shop for loans for older vehicles, or credit unions some might be using--if anyone has recommendations.

Looks like NASA had some good loans though...

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Tom, the biggest problem you'll find is that some lending institutions will not loan out money for cars that have more than 100,000 miles on them.

That said, I am a member at NASA and Pentagon Federal credit union. Both excellent. But I do believe they have restrictions on higher-mileage cars.

[echo46]

Guys, I've been a BMW owner my whole life. Had and e30 and now have an 1995 e36 vert and 2003 330i e46. Always had my eye out for a ZHP--50,000 to 70,000 miles, good maintenance record and fairly clean. Prices are all over the board. What price range do you guys think I should be in for a 2003 to 2004 6sp mt ZHP with above miliage in the general New York area? However, I am willing to travel. Thanks and great site. I've been over on E46 Famanatics for a long time.

[danewilson77]

LOL.....I responded to your new member thread...and you have filled in the blanks.

You should be willing to pay $15,000 to 19,000 based on mileage, condition, and location. FYI...East Coast ZHP's are typically more expensive than Westies....from historical evidence.

Mine had 98k miles, and I paid $17.2k for it. Probably a lil more than I should have...but I wanted to bring the car back to life...and give it a home. The right price for mine was prolly around $16k-$16.5k I would say.

[echo46]

My budget is around 17,000. Hoping to find something with 65,000 to 75,000 miles.

[danewilson77]

My budget is around 17,000. Hoping to find something with 65,000 to 75,000 miles.

Copy. Eyes are open.

[mimalmo]

Not a ZHP but if my kids were still little...

http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/dak/clt/2478021649.html

[danewilson77]

Not a ZHP but if my kids were still little...

http://minneapolis.craigslist.org/dak/clt/2478021649.html

Proper wheel positioning in pic 3.

HTC Thunderbolt+TT

[flexlewis]

new to the forum, im looking to dump my 01' Audi B5 S4 Auto POS and get back into a BMW, Ive been looking at this ZHP for a couple days now and thinking of pulling the trigger if i can get for ~$15k and wanted to get ZHPMafia's opinion on condition of car ,price, and auto trans reliable ?
05' Imola on black
auto trans.
54,841 miles
2 owner
carfax looks ok
vin#WBAEV53415KM38618
$20,900
http://www.maplewoodaudi.com/used/BMW/2005-BMW-3+Series-38a69de00a0d066900a22e0c565ff4ad.htm

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Flex, I moved your post to a different thread -- where we discuss valuations.

Welcome to the site.

[pleasecorrupt]

new to the forum, im looking to dump my 01' Audi B5 S4 Auto POS and get back into a BMW, Ive been looking at this ZHP for a couple days now and thinking of pulling the trigger if i can get for ~$15k and wanted to get ZHPMafia's opinion on condition of car ,price, and auto trans reliable ?
05' Imola on black
auto trans.
54,841 miles
2 owner
carfax looks ok
vin#WBAEV53415KM38618
$20,900
http://www.maplewoodaudi.com/used/BMW/2005-BMW-3+Series-38a69de00a0d066900a22e0c565ff4ad.htm

overpriced by a good grand or two. for 20k range you can get a car with 30k miles. mine had 48 and I bought it for 17.4k but it also depends where you are located, got the best stuff on the west coast :)

reread post: anything around 17k is a good price for that car , but the cheaper the better :rockon

[ecrabb]

OK, what do you guys think of this car?

http://www.hollerdriversmart.com/used/BMW/2005-BMW-330-cdece62c0a0d06490101aec1ce0b42dd.htm

$13,900, 74,7xx miles... Supposedly a one-owner car and the abbreviated autocheck seems to back that up. Obviously, I need to pay somebody to get eyes on and drive it, but assuming the PPI is good, I'd have them ship. A VIN decoder that spit out German seemed to indicate 6MT - "getriebe: manuelle" ;), but I'm waiting for confirmation. Nasty bumper sticker that will hopefully come off, but if it would, it would surprise me the dealer didn't take it off. May mean painting the bumper(s)... Oh, and I'm not positive on the color... Silver Gray?

So, what do you guys think of the price given I'll probably spend a couple hundy on PPI, another $600 on shipping, and $800 or so on taxes once I register it? That puts me at about $15.5 all-in (at asking price), which is exactly where my target budget is. Not that shipping or taxes matter... I'll pay for all that crap regardless of where I buy the car. It's highly unlikely I'll find the right car close-by, so I'll have to ship or buy plane ticket and gas..

Thanks, guys!
SC

[pleasecorrupt]

OK, what do you guys think of this car?

http://www.hollerdriversmart.com/used/BMW/2005-BMW-330-cdece62c0a0d06490101aec1ce0b42dd.htm

$13,900, 74,7xx miles... Supposedly a one-owner car and the abbreviated autocheck seems to back that up. Obviously, I need to pay somebody to get eyes on and drive it, but assuming the PPI is good, I'd have them ship. A VIN decoder that spit out German seemed to indicate 6MT - "getriebe: manuelle" ;), but I'm waiting for confirmation. Nasty bumper sticker that will hopefully come off, but if it would, it would surprise me the dealer didn't take it off. May mean painting the bumper(s)... Oh, and I'm not positive on the color... Silver Gray?

So, what do you guys think of the price given I'll probably spend a couple hundy on PPI, another $600 on shipping, and $800 or so on taxes once I register it? That puts me at about $15.5 all-in (at asking price), which is exactly where my target budget is. Not that shipping or taxes matter... I'll pay for all that crap regardless of where I buy the car. It's highly likely I'll find the right car close-by, so I'll have to ship or buy plane ticket and gas..

Thanks, guys!
SC

good price for what it is, id ask for some more interior pics, the one they provided is just stupid for an actual dealership, you think they'd know what to do... but back to the point, if everything checks out, 15.5 all together would be a good price.

[ecrabb]

Thanks! I thought it seemed like a pretty good price, but that won't stop me from trying to get a little more... Still liking the idea of a coupe, though... Transmission is non-negotiable. Number of doors is open for consideration.

Still waiting for confirmation back on the transmission... Must be a big parking lot because it's taking a loooong time to answer that simple question. ;)

SC

[flexlewis]

I emailed this guy about his "eurospec" 04" ZHP ..but no response..what do you guys think ?

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.jsp?ct=p&car_id=285136202&dealer_id=65606141&car_year=2004&systime=&doors=&model=330I&search_lang=en&start_year=2004&keywordsfyc=&keywordsrep=&highlightFirstMakeModel=&search_type=both&distance=0&min_price=&rdm=1310500378844&drive=&marketZipError=false&advanced=y&fuel=&keywords_display=&lastBeginningStartYear=1981&end_year=2005&showZipError=y&make2=&certified=&engine=&dma=CHICAGO_N2&page_location=findacar%3A%3Aispsearchform&body_code=0&transmission=&default_sort=priceDESC&max_mileage=&color=RED&address=60061&sort_type=priceDESC&max_price=&color2=&make=BMW&seller_type=b&num_records=25&cardist=328&standard=false

[pleasecorrupt]

i think the words too much sums it all up. keep looking for haggle it down to ~22k

[jdub486]

I found a 2006 Silver gray over black leather zhp 330ci 6sp for sale 30 minutes from home. I may move quickly on this. 35k miles, leather, black cube, cold weather, 6sp, no nav, exterior looks pristine, interior looks good. Priced at 23,500 at a toyota dealer.

thoughts?

[danewilson77]

Where is home?

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Dane, east coast.

Jdub, if you could get that price to $22K I bet you'd be happy. That's a fair price now, though. East coast car, 2006, all options (minus NAV), located right by you, etc.

Offer $22K. See if they'll come down.

[danewilson77]

^agree.

[jdub486]

http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail.jsp?tracktype=usedcc&csDlId=&csDgId=&listingId=69452104&listingRecNum=2&criteria=prMx%3D25000%26sf1Dir%3DDESC%26prMn%3D0%2 6mkId%3D20005%26stkTyp%3DU%26bsId%3D20203%26mdId%3 D20409%26rd%3D100000%26crSrtFlds%3DstkTypId-feedSegId-mkId-mdId-pseudoPrice-bsId%26zc%3D20814%26rn%3D0%26PMmt%3D1-1-0%26stkTypId%3D28881%26sf2Dir%3DASC%26sf1Nm%3Dpric e%26sf2Nm%3Dmiles%26rpp%3D50%26feedSegId%3D28705&aff=national

[knosker]

hmm, 23,590 seems a bit steep even for a dealer. Also, the transmission says automatic

[Marcus-SanDiego]

jdub, I am moving this to the "is it a good" thread.

[CO318ti]

My wife and I are fans of BMWs in general, and particularly 3-series. She has an e90 328xi and we just purchased a very nice '95 318ti last week. Now this has caught our eye, and I plan on going to look at it tomorrow (it'd be kinda cool to have the last three generations in the garage). Note the description says "auto" but it's actually a 6-speed manual. The asking price certainly seems a bit high, but I'm curious as to what you all think.

http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail.jsp?tracktype=usedcc&csDlId=&csDgId=&listingId=70332123&listingRecNum=5&criteria=sf1Dir%3DDESC%26mkId%3D20005%26stkTyp%3DU %26mdId%3D20409%26rd%3D30%26crSrtFlds%3DstkTypId-feedSegId-mkId-mdId%26zc%3D80602%26rn%3D0%26PMmt%3D1-1-0%26stkTypId%3D28881%26sf2Dir%3DASC%26sf1Nm%3Dpric e%26sf2Nm%3Dmiles%26isDealerGrouping%3Dfalse%26rpp %3D50%26feedSegId%3D28705&aff=national

Thanks!

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Nice car. Overpriced.

Before I looked at the mileage, I saw the year and price. Based on that, I assigned it a mileage (figured it was about 30,000 miles). Then I saw that it was 62,000 miles. That's too expensive for that car. I'd expect that kind of price for an east coast dealer -- not a Colorado dealer.

I think that car should be priced at closer to $19K.

[CO318ti]

Thanks for the quick reply - I also figured it should be an $18-19k car, considering the miles. My guess is the dealer will give it a go at the inflated price for a couple of weeks, in hopes of finding that buyer desperate for one of these. I like it quite a bit, but am far from desperate for it, so I'll likely wait it out and see if the car sits.

Thanks!

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Good call. There are others out there, too.

[BimmerRules!]

Hello,

Thanks to one of the members, I found this listing in Maryland. Not 100% sure if it is a zhp (edit - it is) but certainly looks like it.

http://www.everycarlisted.com/printcar/md/hagerstown/bmw/3-series/vin-wbabd53426pd99910

http://www.dealerrater.com/classifieds/2006-BMW-3-Series-ad-WBABD53426PD99910/


It's listed as auto but it is a stick. 2006 coupe, 35k miles and being sold by a Toyota dealer. Looks great.

However, unable to negotiate price down beyond $23.2k.

Thoughts on the price?

Also, there are no reputable BIMRs affliated shops nearby and the nearest BMW dealer is more than 50 miles away. How can we get a PPI done and the codes checked? Or, can I rely on the Toyota dealer's inspection and get back to them if I find any trouble when I have my dealership in NY check it?

Thanks in advance!

[pleasecorrupt]

has wheels and body of zhp but ~2k overpriced. i'd wait on it. let it sit on the lot while you continue looking and throw another offer later on. pretty sure it wont move at that price

[BimmerRules!]

has wheels and body of zhp but ~2k overpriced. i'd wait on it. let it sit on the lot while you continue looking and throw another offer later on. pretty sure it wont move at that price

Thanks for the quick feedback PC.

My BMW dealer confirmed that it has performance package.

I thought it was well priced because of the recent sales of the other '06 and even '05 bimmers around that price level @ indy car shops and dealerships.

And per kbb - which I agree is not a great guide but still offers a ballpark # to start negotiations - this car with cold and perfomance pkg has a value of $23.9k for 'good' condition from a private party. (this one certainly looks excellent, which as per kbb is $25k from a private party and get this: $27.5k if sourced from a dealer!)

That said, glad to read your feedback because I am tempted to pull the trigger. :biggrin

In fact, I already called the dealer and offered to put down $1k as a deposit; he called me back and left a vm wanting to know by city/town for the tag and taxes.

I will wait until tomorrow before I call back.

[BCS_ZHP]

BR,
PM'd you back.

[BimmerRules!]

BR,
PM'd you back.

Got it and responded. Thank you very much.

An adequate word that succiently captures my reaction on seeing your thoughtful mail: WOW! Really! :)

Irrespective of whether I end up buying this car or not, your guidance and patient feedback are of tremendous value that will be useful always!

The fact that you would take the time to help out a member whom you have never seen or heard about speaks volumes of your generous nature. Thanks again. Very much appreciated and something worth trying to emulate.

Would like to award you the 'member of the month' prestige. :)

[King]

Just joined - love the site. I have been stalking for a couple of weeks.
In Columbus OH - I had an '03 M3 which met an unfortunate demise - detailslater and maybe a picture but it will make you cry.
2 years after it's demise I am looking for a replacement - i beleive that is a sufficient mourning period.
Want to replace it with an 05 - 06 ZHP.

Have found the following
05 - 67.7K miles
Looks to be in good shape - needs rear rubber but apart from that looks good (Of course just rolling off pictures and a conversation from the seller)
Carfax looks reasonable - 3 oweners with mainly just dealer service.
I talked him to $16,700 - seems fair to me.
Has cold weather - no nav.

Thoughts?

I need to purchase a ticket this aft for tomorrow morning to go get it - 7 hour drive home should be fun.....

Thanks

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Based on nothing more than mileage and year, it's priced right.

[King]

Thanks for the quick response. That is what I thought as well.
As it is a plane ride away it is a bit of a leap of faith but it looks good - attached are the shots.

http://www.comptonmotors.com/vehicledetails.aspx?VID=137624721

Cheers

Love the site!

[Marcus-SanDiego]

King, it looks clean.

[jdub486]

I found a nice, clean 2006 330ci zhp 6sp coupe with 35k miles from a private seller. It is black sapphire on black leather with black cube, no nav. Very clean inside and out. No service records. New tires. Seller asking 24k, got him down to 22.5. What do you think of that price for a low mileage, clean 2006?

[danewilson77]

Hmmmm....I would want for 21k.

HTC Thunderbolt+TT

[Pooters]

Hell yea that's a good deal. That's well below blue book.

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Definitely a good deal. Knock it down another $500 for lack of service records. Make it an even $22K and close the deal.

Jdub, I moved your thread into the "is it a good deal" thread.

[jdub486]

Sorry, I meant to say earlier the car is at a dealer, but it's Monday and my brain is not functioning. The car was a trade in. It has been on the lot 3 weeks. Lots of offers, one person put money down and backed out, but they still won't budge after all this. Any tips? If I could get it to 22k I'd put money down. Should I risk waiting it out? Two months searching now...

[Marcus-SanDiego]

Here's the way I look at this: You're $500 apart. If you go up $500, you've got a deal. If you don't go up $500, the car might get sold.

Is this car worth an extra $500? That's what you need to decide.

[jdub486]

Here's the way I look at this: You're $500 apart. If you go up $500, you've got a deal. If you don't go up $500, the car might get sold.

Is this car worth an extra $500? That's what you need to decide.


In the grand scheme of things $500 is not much. I guess it's the principle. The dealer claims to have paid 20.5k on the trade-in. We all know that is bogus. I also must have the silver cube trim and will pick up a set at Tischer BMW for around $500 if I go for this car. If it is like the two other e46's I have had owned it will need new vanos seals and a rattle kit... factor another $450.