AGM Batteries are a fucking SCAM

[Fried_Chicken]

Once you spend a little time in the automotive industry, you start to smell the low-level scams all over the place. The snake oil engine additives, the chinesium gadgets that don't do anything but claim to do a lot of stuff. Marketing driven crap for weekend warriors to feel good about themselves: K&N Air filters. The entire detailing industry: for people with no mechanical skills but who love their cars and want to feel like they're doing something for them. (Hint: use any strong soap, water, and dry using sheepskin, then if you're intrepid rub some wax into the car). None of this costs money, but if you have more money than sense, people will happily accomodate you.

Once you spend a little more time, you start noticing higher level scams. These scams will fool dealership mechanics and the general public alike, and are particularly insidious because those mechanics lend them a LOT of credibility, and there might even be a tiny hint of truth to what they're pushing.

Examples include this ATF additive that comes in a can. You could collect the tops and they'd give free rewards or something (huge red flag). Even Mercedes dealerships used this, but it was a gigantic bunch of baloney

Tires also fall into this category, especially motorcycle tires. Motorcycle tires that cost $300+ and have a little figure of a devil on them. "New" tires that convince you that people haven't been riding motorcycles fast until the advent of this tire, and if you use the old tire, you're going to slip and die. Read carefully their claims, the way they talk about grip will immediately become familiar to anyone that's ever bought illicit drugs before. "This is the best shit man, it has so much grip. Dude this new batch I got has so much grip you won't believe. This shit grips HARD dude, you gotta try my new stock". Yeah. I'm sure there are new developments, but it's a minor distinction that happens over decades, not every year.

The real irony is these super grippy tires last fuck all, and cost a fortune. Somehow people got convinced spending $300 for a tire that lasts 2k miles is a good idea.

Anyway, then there are the really high level scams that fool not just the general public, industry workers, but even the automotive manufacturers. Fucking AGM batteries.

"Absorbant Glass Mat" and "Gel Cell Batteries".

Supposedly they last longer (red flag here), the prices are ASTRONOMICAL, and THEY CANNOT BE SERVICED!
A lead-acid battery is an EXTREMELY simple thing: 1. lead plates, bathed in 2. Acid.

They work, they are reliable, they can be made in whatever shape/form you want. People somehow got convinced they need this specific lead acid battery, and if you get one that's shaped in such a way to go into a higher-end car (including the ZHP), spread your legs b/c you're about to get FUCKED. But if that fuckening wasn't enough, now they've come up with "Sealed" and "Valve regulated lead-acid". They promise all sorts of goodies, but you know what? If they get cold, or discharge once, they're DEAD. The battery manufacturers have turned what's generously $50 worth of material and a century old technology into a $250 piece of shit that lasts a fuckall amount of time, cannot be serviced, and is fragile and pissy.

Understand these batteries emerged on the automotive scene maybe around 2012, and people have become convinced they must put them into all their high-end vehicles, because "new electronics blah blah blah blah blah BLAH BLAH BLAH" FUCK YOU.

Yes a dying battery can wreak havoc on technology, but SEALED BATTERIES ARE NOT THE ANSWER. From now on I'm only ever installing traditional lead acid batteries with ports that I can open up. I'm so furious right now for the HUNDREDS of dollars I've wasted, and HOURS spent researching trying to buy the right one. Worse still, apparently AGM requires special chargers to actually work right, which really calls into question the point of all of it.

Fuck AMG batteries, FUCK SEALED BATTERIES, FUCK THE INDUSTRY FOR THIS GIGANTIC LOAD OF BULLSHIT.

Sulfuric Acid is one of the cheapest and most produced industrial chemicals there is. It's regulated by a retarded government bureaucracy, and that's scared the general public from getting it, and made it inaccessible, but the reality is it's plentiful and available.


Fuck this.

[Oli77]

You sound pretty mad about it there Mr. Fried Chicken. Just know this, everybody loves Fried Chicken!

Honestly I have zero knowledge on the subject but understand that in me E93, when the battery dies, I might have to "condition the battery to its new home" and take it to the dealer to make sure the marriage between the initial power cell and the vehicle goes smoothly.

I am not convinced if this is true or if, like in all my previous cars, I can just buy one at Walmart.

The AGM vs. non AGM version of the H6-H8 batteries is only about ~$20.

[Fried_Chicken]

You sound pretty mad about it there Mr. Fried Chicken. Just know this, everybody loves Fried Chicken!

Honestly I have zero knowledge on the subject but understand that in me E93, when the battery dies, I might have to "condition the battery to its new home" and take it to the dealer to make sure the marriage between the initial power cell and the vehicle goes smoothly.

I am not convinced if this is true or if, like in all my previous cars, I can just buy one at Walmart.

The AGM vs. non AGM version of the H6-H8 batteries is only about ~$20.

OMFG THAT'S RIGHT YOU HAVE TO CODE THE BATTERIES TO THE CAR NOW. THE STUPIDITY IS SO PALPABLE.

Non-AGM batteries you can replace the acid, pump it full of electrons, and be golden. AGM batteries will fail if you look at them wrong in the cold, and then you can take it up the ass when you get a new one.

[az3579]

AGM batteries will fail if you look at them wrong in the cold, and then you can take it up the ass when you get a new one.

That must be why my touring starts right up, the first time, every time, after 3 years of exposure to really cold weather, right?

Just because you had a bad experience doesn't mean they're trash. Just the fact that I don't have to dick around with venting or "maintaining" it is enough to make it worth my while. Who the hell wants to "maintain" a battery with doing anything other than not letting it go dead? Nobody.


BTW, Oli, the process you're referring to with the E93 is called battery registration. It's necessary to do this to ensure the car charges the battery optimally to prolong the life of the battery.



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[Galapolis]

I switched to a Lithium battery after ZHPizza's recommendation earlier this year and I don't think I can ever go back to AGM or lead acid. I simply can't justify carrying around a 55lbs lump when a 5lbs battery half the size does the exact same thing.

[t.er]

I switched to a Lithium battery after ZHPizza's recommendation earlier this year and I don't think I can ever go back to AGM or lead acid. I simply can't justify carrying around a 55lbs lump when a 5lbs battery half the size does the exact same thing.How did you mount it? My OEM one is from 2014 and still going strong, but may as well go that route whenever this one kicks the can

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[John in VA]

Honestly I have zero knowledge on the subject but understand that in me E93, when the battery dies, I might have to "condition the battery to its new home" and take it to the dealer to make sure the marriage between the initial power cell and the vehicle goes smoothly.

I am not convinced if this is true or if, like in all my previous cars, I can just buy one at Walmart.
It's called "registering" the battery, to tell your electrical system that the battery has been replaced, and it's real. You can purchase your battery anywhere but need to register it - not needed for the E46. Failure to do so can shorten the live of your overpriced battery!

[Galapolis]

How did you mount it? My OEM one is from 2014 and still going strong, but may as well go that route whenever this one kicks the can

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I used the included feet and taped them to the existing bracket. With the feet, the height is the same as a standard battery so you can just use the stock top bracket to secure it. It just clicks into the feet so it's very easy to remove and take with you for charging or whatever.

3964039641

[Fried_Chicken]

That must be why my touring starts right up, the first time, every time, after 3 years of exposure to really cold weather, right?

Just because you had a bad experience doesn't mean they're trash. Just the fact that I don't have to dick around with venting or "maintaining" it is enough to make it worth my while. Who the hell wants to "maintain" a battery with doing anything other than not letting it go dead? Nobody.


BTW, Oli, the process you're referring to with the E93 is called battery registration. It's necessary to do this to ensure the car charges the battery optimally to prolong the life of the battery.



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If only it were just one battery... It's been like 5 over the past 5 years, $1k worth of batteries with these fucking shits costing a fortune, and that includes several warranty replacements. Little known fact: there are basically 3 battery manufacturers in the world, and all their AGM offerings are shit.

I had one that went bad and fried my ZHP's ECU, requiring me to find a used one and mercifully find someone who could flash it. Run them empty once and they're pretty much done for. They also tend to fail in the summer but you don't notice until winter. Once they're done, I bet they're shipped to india for reconditioning or something.

I have no memory ever of a battery venting hydrogen gas or requiring maintenance, but at least having the option would be nice.

Lithium batteries scare me.

[cakM3]

I used the included feet and taped them to the existing bracket. With the feet, the height is the same as a standard battery so you can just use the stock top bracket to secure it. It just clicks into the feet so it's very easy to remove and take with you for charging or whatever.

3964039641

Do they come with posts so that you can screw those posts in and then connect them to your car?

[Galapolis]

I got the posts separately from Amazon. They are cheap.

[cakM3]

I got the posts separately from Amazon. They are cheap.

Found them, thanks! :)

I like your solution . . . thinking of doing the same for my ZHP as well :thumbsup

[Oli77]

I got the orange battery symbol on my e93 after turning it off this morning.

I have no cables or software to code the battery and register it, that is problem #1.

I might not need to code a new battery if I get the exact match to the one I have in terms of CCA, AmpH, and size (i think it is an H8 in the convertible) and I can find it in the non-AGM version.

When the time comes, I hope I can replace it and then drive it to indy to register the new battery.

[az3579]

If only it were just one battery... It's been like 5 over the past 5 years, $1k worth of batteries with these fucking shits costing a fortune, and that includes several warranty replacements. Little known fact: there are basically 3 battery manufacturers in the world, and all their AGM offerings are shit.

I had one that went bad and fried my ZHP's ECU, requiring me to find a used one and mercifully find someone who could flash it. Run them empty once and they're pretty much done for. They also tend to fail in the summer but you don't notice until winter. Once they're done, I bet they're shipped to india for reconditioning or something.

I have no memory ever of a battery venting hydrogen gas or requiring maintenance, but at least having the option would be nice.

Lithium batteries scare me.It is sounding like something might be wrong with your car. What you describe sounds like something is wonky with your electrical system, because it's extremely unusual to have that many bad batteries in a row. Are you sure your alternator is up to scratch and don't have power drain issues?
I got the orange battery symbol on my e93 after turning it off this morning.

I have no cables or software to code the battery and register it, that is problem #1.

I might not need to code a new battery if I get the exact match to the one I have in terms of CCA, AmpH, and size (i think it is an H8 in the convertible) and I can find it in the non-AGM version.

When the time comes, I hope I can replace it and then drive it to indy to register the new battery.Battery registration is done every time the battery is replaced, BUT coding may be required if you change the amperage or the type of battery (such as going from lead-acid to AGM or vice versa). Yes, unfortunately the battery amperage/type is hard coded to the VO. So, if you replace with the same exact amperage and type, then VO coding won't be necessary and you can get away with just registration.

I've had a spare laptop I've been wanting to set up as a spare programming station, just never got around to having the disposable cash to get it set up with a drive large enough storage drive for ALL of the software I want to put on it. But, registration and coding for battery type/amperage doesn't require the large software, so what I can do for you is install the bare minimum to accomplish those tasks, ship you the laptop and cable, and do it remotely after you replace the battery. Ship it back when you're done, just pay shipping both ways. Work for you?

It may be worth asking the Indy how much it would cost for them to just do it; if it's cheap enough, it may be worth doing that since shipping is expensive. If it's a lot then let me know if this is what you want to do.

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[Oli77]

Thank you soooo much for the offer BP!

The car stopped bitching about the battery shortly after I posted the post. It was about -6F for 3-4 days while the car just sat there when I went overseas, so it could be that this was the issue that made the battery bark at me. It was ~55-60F when I started it for the first time after I came back so I didn't think the cod could have been the culprit, but perhaps it was because I have been good and trouble free since I started driving the car everyday back to work.

Let me call the indy and see how much to register and we'll take it from there.

Again, I really appreciate the offer, and will get back to you.

[Fried_Chicken]

It is sounding like something might be wrong with your car. What you describe sounds like something is wonky with your electrical system, because it's extremely unusual to have that many bad batteries in a row. Are you sure your alternator is up to scratch and don't have power drain issues?

Possible power drain issues, but still not something that should kill a battery, and if it does, a normal lead-acid can be fully revived for cheap, but not a retarded AGM battery.

[Oli77]

Don't want to highjack Fried_Chicken's thread, but I learned from my Indy that the battery registration would be free! Thanks again so very much BP.
I love your helping hand and might reach our to you via PM if I need some coding need!

[racer2086]

Fried chicken, you have something wrong with your car. I have AGM batteries in the zhp, e38 and e39. Zhp battery came in the car when I bought it in 2018. Still going. My wife's E39 battery is from 2014. I just replaced the AGM in my E38 last year. But the new one kept dying after a few days. I found my Bluetooth TCU was causing a battery drain. Then even after fixing that, it would keep dying... Every time the store would charge it the machine would say it was ok. That's because the float charge helps long enough to cover up the bad cell that it had. Once I swapped for a new one and had the drain fixed, it's been rock solid.

I will NEVER use a flooded battery again. I have lost count of the number of times I had them and they leaked all over the trunk despite being hooked up to the vent. They make them so cheap now, they all leak at some point between the body and top. I'd rather spend more on the battery than corrode my car.

With everything off and the car in sleep (leave the doors open and turn off interior lights), take a voltmeter and measure for a voltage drop across each fuse. The first one you find with a measurable drop is the circuit with your drain. Could even be your alternator.