Tyler AKA YoitsTmac ZHP Coupe Hunt!

[YoitsTmac]

Hey everyone! Alright lets get the sad part out of the way. I was rear ended trying to turn into my driveway by a lifted Tacoma on 32" wheels. The bumper got split down the middle and the damage on the right quarter panel pulled the left quarter panel. Apparently $15,000 in damage will total the car. I am recovering but sadly am not at 100%, but if I stopped every time I wanted to feel sorry for myself, I wouldn't be here today. I appreciate everyone's concern for my health. I am 23 and in the best shape of my life. I'm sad my workout sessions on Tuesday and Thursday have stopped, but an important step towards a proper recovery :). Now that we got the soppy stuff out of the way, time to get down to brass tax.

Now that I'm an established adult (got my certificate in the mail and everything), I think its time I get myself something nice and close to what I envision for the final picture. I said it on my YouTube and I'll say it here, but E46 is my favorite chassis ever made. I've driven 500hp M235i's. I've driven F80. I've driven E92 M3. I love each of those cars for different reasons, but I love E46. It's far from perfect, but it's a fantastic canvas begging for your interpretation of perfection.

So how do I draw on the canvas? Boy, it will take me years, but let's start with the obvious: six gears in the middle, three pedals under my feet, sport package and an exterior look to match. So the ZHP fits the bill perfectly! For this hunt, I'm looking for coupes only. I'm a millennial damnit, life wouldn't be the same if I wasn't inconveniencing myself! Creative writing aside, here's my hunt:

car has been purchased.

[BMWCurves]

Good luck! They exist, you'll find one. I wouldn't get too hung up on the Premium Package - ZHPs come standard with a lot of the items in the Premium Package for non-ZHP cars (automatic rain-sensing wipers, power seats, moonroof), and some of the items were superseded as well (different tire/wheel combo, three spoke steering wheel, wood grain trim). The only items that are in the Premium Package on a ZHP are:


Auto-dimming rear-view mirror (can be easily retrofitted)
Lumbar support (again, easily retrofitted)
BMW Assist (I have no idea if that even still works)
Leather upholstery (frequently optioned on its own)

I'd say the Cold Weather Package is more useful, but in coupes we already have fold down rear seats as standard (it's a part of the package for sedans), the headlight washers tend to leak and fail, the ski bag I sometimes actually wish I had, and heated front seats can be optioned individually or retrofitted.

[DeathTrap]

I’m a millennial, but I have convenienced myself by buying a wagon. The ultimate E46 platform. That’s a fact, not an opinion.

Continuing, sorry for your loss. Are you opposed to doing a manual swap? It’ll increase your options a bit.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Galapolis]

You could always get a base model and spend too many years and too many thousands of dollars converting it into a ZHP. Not that I'm speaking from experience or anything.

I know you want a coupe but I was going to say that you probably would not want the premium package on the sedan so that you can get the holy grail combo of slicktop + non-folding seats.

Even on the coupe, auto dimming mirror just means something additional to break, just like the headlight washers.

Also only get the black interior. Anything else means stripping out EVERYTHING to replace the carpet. All two-tone interiors start with a black interior and just add seats + door cards and potentially a dash + center console if it's Individual.

Also if your age from that other thread is accurate, you are Gen Z. Millennials are bitter old timers with mortgages and families by now.:)

[YoitsTmac]

I actually did not know that about the premium package - that the auto dimming mirror is apart of it! Or the leather, I assumed leather came on all E46's and then nappa leather on M3? And yeah I don't care about heated seats unless the interior is brown probably. I think that color is my end goal.


I’m a millennial, but I have convenienced myself by buying a wagon. The ultimate E46 platform. That’s a fact, not an opinion.

Continuing, sorry for your loss. Are you opposed to doing a manual swap? It’ll increase your options a bit.

Absolutely. I mean, I have a car with a complete manual and a lifetime warranty on the clutch. So yes, absolutely considering autos. I'm actually having some friends in LA check out a 2004 ZHP with 135k miles but is an auto. 135k feels a smidge high mileage to be honest.


So yes I am looking at that grey on black ZHP and also this red ZHP: https://lascruces.craigslist.org/cto/d/las-cruces-2005-bmw-330ci-zhp/7374845568.html

The owner has been wonderful to work with. I mean, so far I've requested if he'd be open to a ppi and for some videos of the body. He agreed to a ppi if I wanted. He also washed the car and sent me a video, and now I'm on the fence

Pros:
- low mileage
- already manual
- sexy combo
- tastefully modded
- thorough maintenance (which doesn't include cooling system)
- valuable interior for resale

Cons:
- out of state, not to mention quite far. A large hassle to get back to NorCal for sure which increases my net purchase cost.
- hood is heavily "pilted" (can't think of the word) by rocks and other debris
- non-color matched headlight trim
- peeling headliner (or C and A's that I can see)
- odd dent ("small" though) in the passenger C pillar
- rear driver bumper corner has a scratch that would need paint
- very heavily swirled paint. Likely never detailed.

I should ask about the weird discoloration in the passenger c-pillar. Maybe it's just polish or heavily swirled. And then there's the price, $14,000. Granted it's only ask, but that price feels like a "this is a clean example" price, but the body is pretty rough. The hood alone is really aggressively pelted and the dent/discoloration in the C pillar is also risky. Then the rear bumper has a scratch deep enough for paint, and the oddly mismatched headlight trim show's how difficult it would be to just find an Imola hood.

Ironically cars and bids has two cars with similar mileage and also red on black coupes with a few mods. They sold for $9.3k and $9.6k but were automatics. So on one front, this guy deserves a premium for the manual. On the other hand, the body is significantly more rough and deserves a "demerit" in value for that. My friends say his mods deserve some premium, but the other cars had some mods as well and mods don't translate as well in resale in my opinion. So I really don't know how to value this car.

Then there's the grey car. It seems the current owner is flipping it. However, if it test drives well and is the right price, does it matter? Aside from a couple dings on the bumper that are smaller than a quarter, it looks pristine (in-person look and test drive is scheduled). It's also listed for $8k for 135k miles. As I said, I have a manual available, so the auto isn't that much of an issue. The interior isn't as nice but it has nearly 50% more miles, so you wouldn't expect it to. Interior is easy to replace unlike body work. The mileage is just a smidge out of my comfort zone, but the body is clean and I like the color more than red. Not mention it's easier to acquire. For me colors go Estoril>White>Silver>Red.

It's a real toss up.

[YoitsTmac]

You could always get a base model and spend too many years and too many thousands of dollars converting it into a ZHP. Not that I'm speaking from experience or anything.

I know you want a coupe but I was going to say that you probably would not want the premium package on the sedan so that you can get the holy grail combo of slicktop + non-folding seats.

Even on the coupe, auto dimming mirror just means something additional to break, just like the headlight washers.

Also only get the black interior. Anything else means stripping out EVERYTHING to replace the carpet. All two-tone interiors start with a black interior and just add seats + door cards and potentially a dash + center console if it's Individual.

Also if your age from that other thread is accurate, you are Gen Z. Millennials are bitter old timers with mortgages and families by now.:)

I missed your post because I spent so long making mine! I was basically ZHP converting my current E46...yes it's an expensive game. I have only seen one slick top E46 coupe in my life. My friend lost it in the fire :(. I won't worry about the rear mirror failing, there's tons on eBay for under like $50 and they are nice. I do dislike the headlight washers...I would delete it as best I could.

I said black dash only because then it'd include two-tone interiors. Anything to not pull that dash off and potentially create rattles. I swapped carpets with my last E46 and would not want to do it again...

Bummer I'm gen Z, the millennial jokes are more fun :). My birthday is October 97', so I'm right on the line depending on who you ask.

[sillieidiot]

I actually did not know that about the premium package - that the auto dimming mirror is apart of it! Or the leather, I assumed leather came on all E46's and then nappa leather on M3? And yeah I don't care about heated seats unless the interior is brown probably. I think that color is my end goal.



Absolutely. I mean, I have a car with a complete manual and a lifetime warranty on the clutch. So yes, absolutely considering autos. I'm actually having some friends in LA check out a 2004 ZHP with 135k miles but is an auto. 135k feels a smidge high mileage to be honest.


So yes I am looking at that grey on black ZHP and also this red ZHP: https://lascruces.craigslist.org/cto/d/las-cruces-2005-bmw-330ci-zhp/7374845568.html

The owner has been wonderful to work with. I mean, so far I've requested if he'd be open to a ppi and for some videos of the body. He agreed to a ppi if I wanted. He also washed the car and sent me a video, and now I'm on the fence

Pros:
- low mileage
- already manual
- sexy combo
- tastefully modded
- thorough maintenance (which doesn't include cooling system)
- valuable interior for resale

Cons:
- out of state, not to mention quite far. A large hassle to get back to NorCal for sure which increases my net purchase cost.
- hood is heavily "pilted" (can't think of the word) by rocks and other debris
- non-color matched headlight trim
- peeling headliner (or C and A's that I can see)
- odd dent ("small" though) in the passenger C pillar
- rear driver bumper corner has a scratch that would need paint
- very heavily swirled paint. Likely never detailed.

I should ask about the weird discoloration in the passenger c-pillar. Maybe it's just polish or heavily swirled. And then there's the price, $14,000. Granted it's only ask, but that price feels like a "this is a clean example" price, but the body is pretty rough. The hood alone is really aggressively pelted and the dent/discoloration in the C pillar is also risky. Then the rear bumper has a scratch deep enough for paint, and the oddly mismatched headlight trim show's how difficult it would be to just find an Imola hood.

Ironically cars and bids has two cars with similar mileage and also red on black coupes with a few mods. They sold for $9.3k and $9.6k but were automatics. So on one front, this guy deserves a premium for the manual. On the other hand, the body is significantly more rough and deserves a "demerit" in value for that. My friends say his mods deserve some premium, but the other cars had some mods as well and mods don't translate as well in resale in my opinion. So I really don't know how to value this car.

Then there's the grey car. It seems the current owner is flipping it. However, if it test drives well and is the right price, does it matter? Aside from a couple dings on the bumper that are smaller than a quarter, it looks pristine (in-person look and test drive is scheduled). It's also listed for $8k for 135k miles. As I said, I have a manual available, so the auto isn't that much of an issue. The interior isn't as nice but it has nearly 50% more miles, so you wouldn't expect it to. Interior is easy to replace unlike body work. The mileage is just a smidge out of my comfort zone, but the body is clean and I like the color more than red. Not mention it's easier to acquire. For me colors go Estoril>White>Silver>Red.

It's a real toss up.

Just try to negotiate lower to something you're more comfortable with. A lot of the cons that you stated are like common items I see in all E46s of that age imo. other than the dent on the C pillar. Just fly over and drive back. Shouldn't cost that much with flights these days starting like $50.

For the other car. I don't think the mileage matters if you're going to do what you told me you're planning to do lol I would just make sure the chassis and other stuff is good.

[sillieidiot]

I missed your post because I spent so long making mine! I was basically ZHP converting my current E46...yes it's an expensive game. I have only seen one slick top E46 coupe in my life. My friend lost it in the fire :(. I won't worry about the rear mirror failing, there's tons on eBay for under like $50 and they are nice. I do dislike the headlight washers...I would delete it as best I could.

I said black dash only because then it'd include two-tone interiors. Anything to not pull that dash off and potentially create rattles. I swapped carpets with my last E46 and would not want to do it again...

Bummer I'm gen Z, the millennial jokes are more fun :). My birthday is October 97', so I'm right on the line depending on who you ask.

You can delete the headlight washers. The entire system. That's what I did. It's just those pumps under the headlight, then the network of hoses under them, and washer tank. I guess new headlight trims too.

Is it expensive? lol It's like less than the price difference between normal and ZHP at the current prices imo. To me, I don't think the ZHP is worth the premium over the normal 330. But I guess that's cause I have a normal one full of M3 parts lol

[YoitsTmac]

It's a little expensive to convert to ZHP between the steering wheel, bumpers and paint in my opinion. ZHP premiums for cars with 6 digit mileage is very slim. Different story for under 100k miles (from what I've seen).

I'm not sure there's a price I'm comfortable with. Like I said, there's "perfect" clean E46's with a very minimal premium over this. He is asking top dollar at 14k. Both my previous E46's had significantly less (like a tenth) hood damage, so I'd rather just wait. The C-pillar dent and discoloration is also concerning.

Yes, I'm having a proxy check out the grey car and I told them the same thing: clean body, clean subframe floor. The rest is all in my control. I just bought an interior. It's basically half the price of the $14k, seems like a no brainer.

edit: this is even cleaner with 15k less miles also for $14k: http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?22487-2003-330i-ZHP-IR-6MT-75K-miles-for-sale. It just doesn't make sense in my opinion, for the red one I'm considering.

[sillieidiot]

I see. I guess we just differ on the damage that we use as our criteria. Of course I want good paint, but I view all paint damage on removable panels (hood/bumpers/etc) as something that can be easily fixed. As long as it's easily fixable it's fine. Chips for instance is just wear imo. Considering that car is in NM, those highways have a ton of rocks and shit so I don't doubt that there will be a ton. I would totally use those demerits to knock the price down though even though I don't consider them a big deal lol I do agree that 14k is way too much. I would consider that price to be like for a car that is at least 8/10 in all aspects. The mods don't usually increase the value of the car whatsoever. Unless it was an OEM retrofit of some sort like say car had manual and now it's powered seats. That would add value. But if you replaced your seats with buckets, it usually makes it worst lol

I think interior items are more pricey. Just the price of all the pillars alone is the price I paid to have all the pillars and headliner wrapped lol There's really no used when it comes to these pieces since all used ones will be peeling. The door cards, if damaged and need replacing are expensive.

I haven't looked recently for car prices. But 3 months ago, the price difference between a normal 330 and zhp of similar mileage/options was $5k. If I put 5k in the car to convert, it would be a way better conditioned ZHP lol


But keep looking. You only just started your search. Don't be impatient :rofl

[YoitsTmac]

Thanks man. Just going to exercise patience. I want to see this grey car through and hear what it's all about before I tell this guy outright no. Yes, I agree the roads in NM are much worse. I don't know what's "easily" replaceable. You're in SoCal, doesn't a hood respray go for like $1,000 at the end of it? I think I'm also just not a fan of the red. I like it because it's pretty, but I'm not sure I want to own it. I could see if I could haggle with him, but yeah I want to see this grey car through. The quarter panel damage is especially concerning. Any idea how much that would cost? Dent repair and paint restore on a C pillar? I have a quote for $500 to redo headliner, A's, B's and C's.

[sillieidiot]

No. I think it's like 600-650. Maybe if I found some shop that just charges more money sure. I think it was like 2500 or so to repaint the front clip. But yeah I'm not a fan of red either, at least for something I own, unless Ferrari lol

[YoitsTmac]

That's actually good to know.

So I talked with the grey car and asked for the carfax, which is when he revealed that it doesn't have 135k miles, but actually 195k miles. So the value proposition just isn't there and I don't think I want a car that old. I messaged the man with the red car. I was "bad" because I said I would message him yesterday and I got sidetrack. I tried messaging him today and the message wouldn't go through (iMessage), which means you're blocked or their phone is off. In the event it was the latter, I sent him an email. I think I'm ready to make a deal with him on the red car if a hood paint is that cheap.

If it's the right price, I'd say the history of the car outweighs the negatives of the color. Like I said, I think red is hot, but it's tough as a daily. If you do something illegal, you'll be the only red car for like 4 miles. There have definitely been times I have been thankful my car is grey to say the least.

[sillieidiot]

No the history does not outweigh the negatives of the color lol But red is actually on your list of colors so I guess. I wouldn't even have it on my list to begin with lol

So I searched for some cars. It looks like the price difference between normal 330 and ZHP is still the same 5k+ lol

Anyways, if you're going to buy that red car. Maybe use this one to tell him his price is too high. Also, this dealership or whatever don't know that they have a ZHP. And they list it as an Auto when it's clearly a manual. It's got slightly more mileage though

https://denver.craigslist.org/ctd/d/englewood-2006-bmw-series-330ci-call-or/7384479655.html

edit:
I kind of want a e46 sedan now. But I have no space for that :rofl

[t.er]

Anyways, if you're going to buy that red car. Maybe use this one to tell him his price is too high. Also, this dealership or whatever don't know that they have a ZHP. And they list it as an Auto when it's clearly a manual. It's got slightly more mileage though

https://denver.craigslist.org/ctd/d/englewood-2006-bmw-series-330ci-call-or/7384479655.html


Or just fly to Denver and drive it back!

[YoitsTmac]

No the history does not outweigh the negatives of the color lol But red is actually on your list of colors so I guess. I wouldn't even have it on my list to begin with lol

So I searched for some cars. It looks like the price difference between normal 330 and ZHP is still the same 5k+ lol

Anyways, if you're going to buy that red car. Maybe use this one to tell him his price is too high. Also, this dealership or whatever don't know that they have a ZHP. And they list it as an Auto when it's clearly a manual. It's got slightly more mileage though

https://denver.craigslist.org/ctd/d/englewood-2006-bmw-series-330ci-call-or/7384479655.html

edit:
I kind of want a e46 sedan now. But I have no space for that :rofl

I’ll buy your white one.

Someone just messaged me about this red one this morning in my SoCal chat. Anyone know someone in Denver?

Last driver did 5k a year. Was told it was an older gentlemen.

[Galapolis]

So I searched for some cars. It looks like the price difference between normal 330 and ZHP is still the same 5k+ lol


I have spent probably about 4k, maybe more, converting my base model to MSport and I still don't have cams, not to mention all that time and effort spent converting it. I'd pay 5k over a 330 any day for a ZHP after having gone through that process.

I think it's absolutely worth it if you've already owned an E46 and will appreciate every small detail the ZHP has to offer. If you are buying an E46 for the first time, I'd argue you'd probably be happy with a 330, though in that situation I would probably still take a beat up ZHP over a base model and just restore it.

[ItsRichieRich]

I’ll buy your white one.

Someone just messaged me about this red one this morning in my SoCal chat. Anyone know someone in Denver?

Last driver did 5k a year. Was told it was an older gentlemen.

A very good customer of mine is Schomp BMW, I can make sure the shop foreman there puts a good guy on it if you wanted to do PPI. He owes me a favor or two haha.

[YoitsTmac]

A very good customer of mine is Schomp BMW, I can make sure the shop foreman there puts a good guy on it if you wanted to do PPI. He owes me a favor or two haha.

I’d love to take you up on that but I just scheduled a ppi for Monday. $180, not gun a sweat it. If I saw that sooner then I’d say yes! Dealer is relatively easy to work with, just hard to hear on the phone. Little sassy about ppi and said he could drive it for me and let me know. Uh, yeah. Sounds a little biased though lol

[sillieidiot]

Or just fly to Denver and drive it back!

Yeah, that's what I would do. Screw the other car. This one looks like I could haggle it down lol I suggest you drive home early in the day so you don't run into the deer on the road at night. Fuck that was so dangerous. By the time it's night, you'll end up in like UT where there's nothing lol


I’ll buy your white one.

Someone just messaged me about this red one this morning in my SoCal chat. Anyone know someone in Denver?

Last driver did 5k a year. Was told it was an older gentlemen.

I have family over there. But none of them are really car people.


I have spent probably about 4k, maybe more, converting my base model to MSport and I still don't have cams, not to mention all that time and effort spent converting it. I'd pay 5k over a 330 any day for a ZHP after having gone through that process.

I think it's absolutely worth it if you've already owned an E46 and will appreciate every small detail the ZHP has to offer. If you are buying an E46 for the first time, I'd argue you'd probably be happy with a 330, though in that situation I would probably still take a beat up ZHP over a base model and just restore it.

I see. I value the experience and fun (or suffering lol) while I was converting some parts before I went a totally different direction. Learned a ton of stuff, met a lot of cool people. Also, I probably wouldn't have modded the way I did if I started out with the ZHP tbh lol After swapping the bumpers, I learned that I could do take shit from other models. It just went downhill from there :facepalm

But yeah, having owned/worked E46s and replacing nearly everything on it. I'm not on the ZHP kool-aid as much. I can do more with the 5k with the knowledge I have now. Of course, you have to enjoy doing the work. If you don't, just get a ZHP lol

[Galapolis]

Not at all what you are looking for but I'm gonna leave it here anyway: https://www.ebay.com/itm/2001-BMW-325i-IT-/165087523918?mkcid=16&mkevt=1&_trksid=p2349624.m46890.l6249&mkrid=711-127632-2357-0

[YoitsTmac]

Seems like a lot of money for a pre-facelift with a dent in the trunk. Should have had more pics of my friends wagon. 330 swap 5spd with a red on black interior. H currently has an Oxford Green wagon he grabbed for some stupid cheap price. He recently found it has already been 330 swapped :)

edit: patiently waiting for PPI tomorrow in Colorado. If there's no outstanding massive issues, I anticipate making a deal.

[Galapolis]

Seems like a lot of money for a pre-facelift with a dent in the trunk. Should have had more pics of my friends wagon. 330 swap 5spd with a red on black interior. H currently has an Oxford Green wagon he grabbed for some stupid cheap price. He recently found it has already been 330 swapped :)

edit: patiently waiting for PPI tomorrow in Colorado. If there's no outstanding massive issues, I anticipate making a deal.

I mean it would probably cost you the current bid just to get the M3 part out car but yeah it's usually not a good idea to buy other people's projects.

[YoitsTmac]

Totally missed that it was M3 swapped. I just read the title and looked at it the first few photos, completely missing under the hood. That all being said, not a bad price at all. Wish I knew someone in the market!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[YoitsTmac]

I’ll link the PPI after work, but not making an offer on the Colorado car.

Link to ppi Edit: https://xoxocar.com/inspection/d42a8fae-da87-4b7d-8cf2-e03874851ed5?sb=def&b=1


For my dollar I want cleaner paint. I can wait. Also electrical issues. Dealer is big mad. Dude was like “it’s a 2006, you’re not going to find something cleaner than this.” My 2001 was cleaner than this one before I bought it. Apparently cars get rough in Colorado according to the mechanic.

The electrical issues are what really did it for me.

[sillieidiot]

yeah in any state that is not the desert, it's rough

edit:
just looked through the pictures. That car has PPF too. looks like all the uncovered areas were the ones that got damaged lol There were some pictures of spots on the PPF, but that would come off. But doesn't help the roof and pillars.

[Galapolis]

Imola red flakes very easily. You'll have a hard time finding a clean one that wasn't owned by an enthusiast. Mystic also has similar issues, mine is starting to lose clear coat all over the place.

[cakM3]

Imola red flakes very easily. You'll have a hard time finding a clean one that wasn't owned by an enthusiast. Mystic also has similar issues, mine is starting to lose clear coat all over the place.

+1

[BH93]

Imola red flakes very easily. You'll have a hard time finding a clean one that wasn't owned by an enthusiast. Mystic also has similar issues, mine is starting to lose clear coat all over the place.

Besides sanding down and blasting another base coat and spraying clears, anyone have a more economical solution to this?

[t.er]

Imola red flakes very easily. You'll have a hard time finding a clean one that wasn't owned by an enthusiast. Mystic also has similar issues, mine is starting to lose clear coat all over the place.

You know your paint is bad when your mom says you didn't clean your car properly, since the front bumper is still so dusty.

"No mom, that's just all the rock chips"

https://i.imgur.com/Jng7fDcl.png

[Galapolis]

If only there were a Mystic Blue repaint group buy option.

[sillieidiot]

Besides sanding down and blasting another base coat and spraying clears, anyone have a more economical solution to this?

I think the only economical solution is to DIY to whole paint job lol It just takes too much time.

[YoitsTmac]

If only there were a Mystic Blue repaint group buy option.

:applause2


Calling about this one tomorrow. First pics, then a PPI, and then maybe Seattle this weekend if everything comes up tip top.

https://seattle.craigslist.org/sno/ctd/d/lynnwood-gorgeous-06-bmw-zhp-330ci-30l/7386914936.html

[sillieidiot]

I thought you weren't comfortable with anything above 135k? At least from that other post.

[YoitsTmac]

I mean, it puts me out of my comfort zone for sure, but at this point I think I could swap in my current motor if need be. My close circle says the mileage should’nt matter to me if I truly have B58 swap plans, and I they may be onto something. Yeah the mileage feels high but if the body is clean, I might be game. The headliner looks good too.

Edit: yeah, I see the price premium per kbb of a 180k car vs 120k car is a grand. I know they’re not a perfect representation but that lines up with cars and bids previous auctions. Sigh, maybe I will pass. The interior and body both look real clean though

[YoitsTmac]

Hunt is still going. I’ve inquired from 4 dealers but they don’t like to move fast. One was quick, selling an 06 ZHP taig on black, but broken cats for $8k with 180k miles, so I walked. The other three are fresh inventory with no pics, two are ZHP’s.

Checked out a local ZHP for 6k but it had profanity etched in the hood, so I left before the owner arrived

[wstr75]

I have enjoyed reading the posts in this thread. Some get to the heart of what seems to be the various forks in the road for potential E46 ZHP ownership. The less than 60K miles ownership purchase path where collectors or near collectors are pursuing, the 60K to 100K path where the car has had some modest repairs (cooling system, for example), the greater than 100K path where the previous/present owners have made all the appropriate age/mileage replacements (suspension parts, cooling system, alternator, various engine gaskets, etc.) and then there is the path above 90K where the previous owners have not done the appropriate age/mileage replacements. The less than 60K ownership bucket is lots of money and, mind you, there will be nearly as much appropriate age/mileage replacements work needing to be done as the E46s with more than 100K miles (my opinion). The above 90K category where the owners have not done the appropriate age/mileage replacement work need to be discounted appropriate to how much required maintenance work is ahead for the new owner.

What has to be considered is how there are many E46s that have more than 300K miles and are close to 50K mile operating condition (yes, paint and seats are likely more worn than a 50K vehicle) where owners have been replacing gaskets, suspension parts, clutches, alternators, pumps, hoses, guibos, etc. as needed. The owners of those cars are proving to us the longevity of E46 engines, transmissions and other gear. If I were in the market for a ZHP now, I'd aim for either the above 100K cars (without rust!) that have not received appropriate age/mileage work for prices less than $6K so as to allow at least $3K for those appropriate repairs in the near future OR buy a higher mileage ZHP that has received all the appropriate age/mileage related work for $9K to $12K depending on paint, interior, color, options, etc. other factors.

[YoitsTmac]

I agree that some high mileage cars are in better condition than others. It kind of is a lick of the draw, especially buying from a dealer. My best friend keeps giving me shade for being picky on mileage saying the same thing. My philosophy is if someone has a low mileage example these days, they have either owned it very long time or paid a premium to purchase it with the low miles before their ownership. In both situations, I personally feel these buyers/owners are more likely to have taken care of the car. If you sought a clean example, the condition of the car is likely important to you and are probably looking to keep it that way.

It gets more difficult with higher mileage. There are tons of owners who have miles on these cars just because they love the cars. My car with 134k is one of them (I think that’s right on the line of high). There was very little rubber left remaining. But I bought that car for $5k, and there are lots of young people with $5k ready to hop into the “sporty” brand, neglect it, beat the piss out of it, maybe overheat it a bit and then sell to move on. I just feel you roll the dice more of buying from that second type of owner when you purchase with higher mileage.

Because I’m swapping in my rear axle, possibly transmission and rebuilding the cooling system/ front suspension anyway, that equation matters less than me. But I want a motor that I feel confident is ready to take the daily mechanical abuse I plan to throw at it for the 1-3 years it takes me to swap a newer motor in it. That all being said, paint is most important to me, and that normally goes hand in hand with mileage more often than it doesn’t. Interior hardly matters too, I just don’t want to pull a dash to introduce rattles. I officially picked up the saddle brown interior…it’s a little rough.

That’s my philosophy anyway. Not saying it’s perfect :). If someone had a high mileage example with maintenance since 80-90k or something and it had clean paint, I’d likely buy it.

[YoitsTmac]

I once mentioned someone who falsely advertised car as 135k with 200k. They said the car came with two clusters and they didn't know they had the wrong one. Well now its correctly advertised and I ran into the listing again. What really caught my eye was a photo under the hood (attached). I have never seen valvetrian this clean, let alone at 200k (edit: just googled e46 valvetrain and found some clean high mileage ones, but appears to be a sign of a well loved car). I can't find anywhere that mentions you can clean it. Curious what you guys think of this? It could be a different car, a different motor, or could be a great example. Would love some thoughts.

38532

Car is grey on black automatic. Bumper looks like someone's license plate bolts tapped it but otherwise paint looks clean but I need someone to look at it, if I even want to pursue it. C pillar is peeling and rough may want to in the following year...The car is under $6k, so leaves a lot of room to do things to the car.

edit: Carfax shows this based on screenshots from seller. I am under the impression the current guy is flipping it and is a dealer or something.

08/07: "new owner reported" with 8,800 miles
03/10: 57,000 miles reported
04/12: 80,100 miles reported
03/14: 106,100 miles reported
05/15: 120,900 miles reported
01/16: 131,000 miles reported
07/16 137,500 miles reported
03/17 148,000 miles reported in Monrovia, CA

All these records are from tire shops or emissions within 40 miles of each other in LA. Here's the interesting part (as if that's not it)

11/17 157,000 reported at BMW of San Francisco for "vehicle serviced: engine checked". Note the geographical location and the fact that this is the first place that isn't a state inspection or tire shop on the Carfax. What would lead someone who never takes it to the dealer or seemingly anywhere (that reports), to suddenly not only take the car to a shop, let alone the dealer? Sounds like someone who really cares about the car in my opinion, tied with the image.

No accidents of any kind reported. Car was sold at auction 09/01/21. Now it's for sale and has been for about two weeks. I have the money to spend what I want for the car I want, but it is also impossible to ignore that more money on the table leads to more future projects with minimal downsides.

[sillieidiot]

I mean the picture looks like they just cleaned all the oil with like a shop towel or something. They cleaned it enough to put some sealant before taking a picture. Honestly, I don't think think it gets as bad people think. Unless you're using like bad gas and oil. My sister's e46 sedan beat the shit out of that car, but always did the oil changes on time and used premium gas. It always looked clean whenever I go to replace the VCG even at 180k (which was the last time I replaced it before the car got totaled).

Let's see, I avoid the dealer like the plague. But I was forced to go to the dealer once. It was for the airbag recall lol So could be that? The other thing is that it could have been traded in, and the dealer just inspected it.

[YoitsTmac]

It should state if the airbag was replaced in the Carfax, no? All it said was "engine service". I didn't know you could clean valve train stain. All I'll say is my existing car was very very yellow when I did my VCG. Regardless, I decided I'm going to wait. I'm not madly in love with it. I'd rather pay more to know a little bit more about the car or for a more desirable combo. I am suddenly lusting for blue. I may even take a non ZHP mystic blue if it gave me the opportunity to rock blue. I have an in for BMW parts at cost thankfully...side skirts, OE rear bumper, probably aftermarket front, some paint. Bam. :) Hopefully we can just find a ZHP though.

[sillieidiot]

Beats me. Then if it doesn't say it, does that mean they still haven't done the recall? Cause BMW fucking spams that shit on you when you don't reply. They mail it in 1000 different ways, call you, email you lol Forgetting about it is not even an option. I purposely ignore it cause my car is in the shop lol

Nice, BMW parts discount I miss. I used to have an in, then he quit lol

Why would you go aftermarket front? like non-mt2? Cause if you're just doing it for cost, wouldn't the aftermarket mt2 rear be better? it has better fitment. Pretty sure the rear bumper (including cost of diffuser) costs more.

[YoitsTmac]

Well I decided to move passed the car. In regards to the bumper, I was thinking aftermarket front just for cost. I have never done any body work on any car, so if you tell me the rear aftermarket is better and to go OE in the front, I'm all ears. Yes, the entire idea of aftermarket would be for cost.

Also any idea what it costs to paint two bumpers? I really only want ZHP for the bumpers and headliner. A headliner is $500, so if the bumpers are a reasonable price I can consider non ZHP cars.

[sillieidiot]

Ok, yeah I was thinking you wanted like M3 front or something. That's like the only reason why you would go with aftermarket front that made sense to me. Honestly, front/rear bumper is like the same price. The rear costs more because you have to buy the diffuser too since it doesn't come with it. When I did the testing for the aftermarket ZHP bumpers. The front has a bad mold where the passenger side is bent down. It's pretty much like that for all of the ones I've come across. You can pull it up, but it can never be perfect since the front bumper doesn't have anything to hold the corners of the bumper up like the rear does. The rear bumper fit on like it's OE, but the plastic is thinner in a lot of places.

I think the front bumper costs like 500ish and the rear bumper is like 600ish to paint. Depending on the shop, aftermarket bumpers cost more to paint cause aftermarket = more prep. I'm sure you can get a good deal if you paint all the stuff at the same time. You going to want the side skirts too. They make a ton of difference on the coupe. On the sedan it's not even that noticeable.

[YoitsTmac]

Thanks for all this info especially since I’ve never ventured into body work and have no idea. I’m thinking the combo/mileage/price is more important than a ZHP VIN. It’ll really come down to my ability to be patient for the right combo too. I’m pretty excited for a blue to be honest which seems there weren’t that many.

Current inquiring about a white 2004 330 with natural brown interior with 140k on the ODO. Last 5 days there has been very little inventory sadly.

Also totally agree on the side skirts. Crazy how much of a pretense they bring.

[Galapolis]

Well I decided to move passed the car. In regards to the bumper, I was thinking aftermarket front just for cost. I have never done any body work on any car, so if you tell me the rear aftermarket is better and to go OE in the front, I'm all ears. Yes, the entire idea of aftermarket would be for cost.

Also any idea what it costs to paint two bumpers? I really only want ZHP for the bumpers and headliner. A headliner is $500, so if the bumpers are a reasonable price I can consider non ZHP cars.

I have a full aftermarket MTech II kit on my car. Painting the front bumper cost me $298, the rear was $350 and the side skirt was $110.

You should go genuine front bumper. I have one too now because while the fitment and quality is quite good on my Taiwan parts, the material they use is not the same as genuine. Original bumpers cannot break, but aftermarket ones can. I crashed into something and the aftermarket bumper shattered into multiple pieces. An original bumper would just flex and go back into shape right away.

[YoitsTmac]

https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=607412422&zip=95624

Price is stupid high for 122k miles
Nice combo
Front bumper fucked
Glasses holder cracked
Dash trim tabs could be damaged.

For what I value it at, I probably couldn’t even make an offer [emoji2375]. I mean $13k for an auto with 100k+ miles. Before anything else, doesn’t add up.

[BH93]

https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=607412422&zip=95624

Price is stupid high for 122k miles
Nice combo
Front bumper fucked
Glasses holder cracked
Dash trim tabs could be damaged.

For what I value it at, I probably couldn’t even make an offer [emoji2375]. I mean $13k for an auto with 100k+ miles. Before anything else, doesn’t add up.
Dash trim is probably missing a post or the tab holding the post is broken, easy enough to fix with epoxy.
You'll probably want to get an aftermarket headunit display so the glasses holder is deleted anyways.
Front bumper probably just needs to be adjusted, looks like it's not sitting correctly on the driver side.


This would be a contender if Alpine White + Natural Brown + last model year are a must for you.
It's cheaper to fix trim pieces and a bumper and swap a 6 speed manual transmission than it is to change the model year, exterior color, or the interior color.

[YoitsTmac]

Dash trim is probably missing a post or the tab holding the post is broken, easy enough to fix with epoxy.
You'll probably want to get an aftermarket headunit display so the glasses holder is deleted anyways.
Front bumper probably just needs to be adjusted, looks like it's not sitting correctly on the driver side.


This would be a contender if Alpine White + Natural Brown + last model year are a must for you.
It's cheaper to fix trim pieces and a bumper and swap a 6 speed manual transmission than it is to change the model year, exterior color, or the interior color.

All fair points. Year doesn’t matter to me too much beyond LCI and now I have a natural brown interior in my room, so combo doesn’t even matter much beyond exterior (although still a bonus). Seat and door panel swaps are just as hard as OFHG :P

I don’t know. It’s like they want $13k, which for that mileage I think should be in better shape. They seem to try and move BMW’s specifically, they shud have at least fixed the bumper sag and glasses holder for like 2-$300. If I wanted to pay that I have an real difficult to work with seller who wants 13k for an 06 white on natural brown with 110k and stunning paint 2 hours away (severe accident this year tho). It’s sat for 3 going on 4 weeks because it’s too high. I mean it’s in CA, this is arguably the best spot to demand a premium and where your buyer most likely lives in my opinion.

The red imola natural brown on Colorado with 120k miles or so has also been sitting for 3 weeks and looks just as good in dealer pics. Just my two cents. Cars and bids has two red on black autos with sub 110k miles sell for under $10k in the last 120 days (one about 45 days ago). Those are the price references I’m using to gauge value. When it gets that high, then I can begin to look at non-ZHP’s for $7k and do bumpers, headliner and wrap the window trim.


Edit: if I’m off my rocks with values someone please put me back in my place.

[BH93]

All fair points. Year doesn’t matter to me too much beyond LCI and now I have a natural brown interior in my room, so combo doesn’t even matter much beyond exterior (although still a bonus). Seat and door panel swaps are just as hard as OFHG :P

I don’t know. It’s like they want $13k, which for that mileage I think should be in better shape. They seem to try and move BMW’s specifically, they shud have at least fixed the bumper sag and glasses holder for like 2-$300. If I wanted to pay that I have an real difficult to work with seller who wants 13k for an 06 white on natural brown with 110k and stunning paint 2 hours away (severe accident this year tho). It’s sat for 3 going on 4 weeks because it’s too high. I mean it’s in CA, this is arguably the best spot to demand a premium and where your buyer most likely lives in my opinion.

The red imola natural brown on Colorado with 120k miles or so has also been sitting for 3 weeks and looks just as good in dealer pics. Just my two cents. Cars and bids has two red on black autos with sub 110k miles sell for under $10k in the last 120 days (one about 45 days ago). Those are the price references I’m using to gauge value. When it gets that high, then I can begin to look at non-ZHP’s for $7k and do bumpers, headliner and wrap the window trim.

Are those dealers open to negotiate? What is the feedback when you reach out to them

[YoitsTmac]

Are those dealers open to negotiate? What is the feedback when you reach out to them

I didn’t negotiate with the red car because the PPI was super bad. I think I linked it above. TLDR: massive chips everywhere, paint chipping off rear bumper, CANBUS errors and water in brake fluid to the point the owner said it probably wasn’t safe. It would have been so much body work to get to the same condition of my last E46.

The local white on brown has zero desire to drop a dollar. I even offer 11 which still felt high. He told me to piss off. I check all local listings 3 times a day. He updates it every 3-5 days so it’s on his mind.

I have not called this Georgia dealer.

I am still trying to contact the non ZHP white on brown 2005 local to me with 130k with a 7.5k list

[cody_94]

Oh shit, that white car is right down the road from me! They used to get ZHPs in all the time but their lot is mostly e90s and e82s now. The price is definitely high but I'm sure they'd take less. That color combo is pretty rare in a ZHP coupe. I very rarely see white ones, much less with natural brown.

[YoitsTmac]

Oh shit, that white car is right down the road from me! They used to get ZHPs in all the time but their lot is mostly e90s and e82s now. The price is definitely high but I'm sure they'd take less. That color combo is pretty rare in a ZHP coupe. I very rarely see white ones, much less with natural brown.

So ironic since there’s one near me. What do you value it at? And maybe PM me to look at it? Can throw you a little something for your time.

[fredo]

AW car looks good. Proceed with caution.

https://www.yelp.com/biz/jet-auto-sales-loganville

https://www.yelp.com/not_recommended_reviews/jet-auto-sales-loganville

[sillieidiot]

All fair points. Year doesn’t matter to me too much beyond LCI and now I have a natural brown interior in my room, so combo doesn’t even matter much beyond exterior (although still a bonus). Seat and door panel swaps are just as hard as OFHG :P

I don’t know. It’s like they want $13k, which for that mileage I think should be in better shape. They seem to try and move BMW’s specifically, they shud have at least fixed the bumper sag and glasses holder for like 2-$300. If I wanted to pay that I have an real difficult to work with seller who wants 13k for an 06 white on natural brown with 110k and stunning paint 2 hours away (severe accident this year tho). It’s sat for 3 going on 4 weeks because it’s too high. I mean it’s in CA, this is arguably the best spot to demand a premium and where your buyer most likely lives in my opinion.

The red imola natural brown on Colorado with 120k miles or so has also been sitting for 3 weeks and looks just as good in dealer pics. Just my two cents. Cars and bids has two red on black autos with sub 110k miles sell for under $10k in the last 120 days (one about 45 days ago). Those are the price references I’m using to gauge value. When it gets that high, then I can begin to look at non-ZHP’s for $7k and do bumpers, headliner and wrap the window trim.


Edit: if I’m off my rocks with values someone please put me back in my place.

Iono I see prices for the dealers to be all in that area. It's always going to be higher than private party. But that's just the listed price. You should negotiate. Those sub 10k is actually 10k after buyer's fee which is 4.5% of the sold price. I consider carsandbids to be more similar to private party as well.

That car looks alright in pictures. All of those things are easily fixable. You should use that to your advantage to knock the price down more. Heck sometimes dealers will fix the issues you point out as well. I got an entire bumper repainted once and managed to haggle them down still lol But yeah. I mean sunglass holder, what is it like $30? takes 5 mins to replace. Front bumper, scraped on the bottom, needs realignment. I guess you could repaint it. I see trim popping out, but you can glue it. nicks on side skirt/rear bumper, touch up lol But you should check it out somehow. Cause I don't trust dealers for shit.

tbh, I feel like you're nitpicking a lot of things. Like you're expecting collector quality stuff for not collector quality price. Like if it was perfect, I would normally see the cars in like the 15k+ range. Good is like 11-14k, fair is like 7-10k.

Also, your comparison with the other white car make no sense to me. car with accident < car without accident lol If the accident is severe like you said, I would not even look at that shit.

[sillieidiot]

came across this lol awful paint color. not a zhp hence the price.

https://offerup.com/item/detail/1285242492?q=bmw+330ci&cid=5.1

why are there so many verts for sale?

Too bad you don't want black. This car looks good in the pictures.

https://offerup.com/item/detail/1270931083?q=bmw+330ci&cid=5.1

Iono why, but I want this lol But it's been posted for a year so probably gone.

https://offerup.com/item/detail/817539044?q=bmw+330ci&cid=5.1

[YoitsTmac]

+1

Paint flakes for Imola, mystic or both?


Iono I see prices for the dealers to be all in that area. It's always going to be higher than private party. But that's just the listed price. You should negotiate. Those sub 10k is actually 10k after buyer's fee which is 4.5% of the sold price. I consider carsandbids to be more similar to private party as well.
I was unaware of the after fee. So that's added after you purchase a car through them? Or just stating that the money the owner gets is actually less?


tbh, I feel like you're nitpicking a lot of things. Like you're expecting collector quality stuff for not collector quality price. Like if it was perfect, I would normally see the cars in like the 15k+ range. Good is like 11-14k, fair is like 7-10k.

Also, your comparison with the other white car make no sense to me. car with accident < car without accident lol If the accident is severe like you said, I would not even look at that shit.
Didn't mean to be nitpicking, but if you don't know I got totally screwed on my first car ($3k in repairs day 1). It was because I was an uniformed buyer. So when I look for a car, I always immediately look at what's wrong. I'm not nicking the car for it. Like you said, they are easy fixes, but I think not even attempting to fix the trim and glasses holder is just a poor indication of the dealer. It would obvious present the car better.

I don't know what collector quality means. I have been watching cars ever since I lost my car on the 14th and have a number of people looking for me, be on here, the Bimmercircuit chat, local CCA and friends. I have seen a lot of cars. I watch them come and go. When determining value, I really think of those last two red on black automatic ZHP's on cars and bids. $9.1k for 97k miles zhp on September 1st - a few chips here and there. May 14th, a red on black automatic ZHP. Few wonky marks on the back, but sold for 9.7k with 97k miles. Lets just say 10.5k adjusted for current prices.

Based on that, automatic ZHP's with over 120k miles should sell for 10k tops in similar condition. The market seems to agree. I have actively considered three ZHP's.

- trig, blk, AT, 180k with dead cats per the dealer. Asking $8k for ~8 days.
- imola, naturalbwn, AT, 122k. Asking 11k and has been stagnant for 28 days on cars.com
- white, naturalbwn, AT 110k. Asking 13k and stagnant 23 days. I know you said there's accidents, but he doesn't state that and in my opinion prices it as if it has had minor to no accidents
- red, suedeblk, MT, 95k. Asked 14k - pulled listing after 30 days stagnant (I don't see it re-up anywhere). Maybe it sold, but the fact it expired and he was willing to do so much to help secure the deal with me implied to me that he decided he'd rather just keep it. I could ask but I would feel bad.

Then there's this that I don't consider: Taig, blk, MT, 75k. Asking 17k. Time listed is unknown, but up for at least 10 days.

I don't know how long a car should sit, but I believe 2+ weeks is when you should begin to worry about price. These are the anchors I use to gauge price. and value. With this anchors, I think $9k would be the right price for that one in Georgia.

[YoitsTmac]

came across this lol awful paint color. not a zhp hence the price.

https://offerup.com/item/detail/1285242492?q=bmw+330ci&cid=5.1

why are there so many verts for sale?

Too bad you don't want black. This car looks good in the pictures.

https://offerup.com/item/detail/1270931083?q=bmw+330ci&cid=5.1

Iono why, but I want this lol But it's been posted for a year so probably gone.

https://offerup.com/item/detail/817539044?q=bmw+330ci&cid=5.1

That black one feels like a really good value. I may send someone to look at it there's always wraps. First one is definitely wrapped. The wrap came out well though

[sillieidiot]

I was unaware of the after fee. So that's added after you purchase a car through them? Or just stating that the money the owner gets is actually less?

Yes. Seller lists for free, get the full value. Buyer pays value + fee. It's similar with BAT too.



Didn't mean to be nitpicking, but if you don't know I got totally screwed on my first car ($3k in repairs day 1). It was because I was an uniformed buyer. So when I look for a car, I always immediately look at what's wrong. I'm not nicking the car for it. Like you said, they are easy fixes, but I think not even attempting to fix the trim and glasses holder is just a poor indication of the dealer. It would obvious present the car better.


No I didn't know that. However, I feel like you are dismissing potential cars for small value fixes. Like OMG this car has a broken front reflector, the whole car is trash. That's what it sounds like you are doing. You should be looking out for high value problems. Any mechanical stuff, rust, chassis problems. You can't fix some of that or it will be very hard.

For the trims and stuff on that dealer. Normally for used cars, they don't fix stuff like that to get it into sellable condition. Maybe a new car or even lease owned.



I don't know what collector quality means. I have been watching cars ever since I lost my car on the 14th and have a number of people looking for me, be on here, the Bimmercircuit chat, local CCA and friends. I have seen a lot of cars. I watch them come and go. When determining value, I really think of those last two red on black automatic ZHP's on cars and bids. $9.1k for 97k miles zhp on September 1st - a few chips here and there. May 14th, a red on black automatic ZHP. Few wonky marks on the back, but sold for 9.7k with 97k miles. Lets just say 10.5k adjusted for current prices.

Based on that, automatic ZHP's with over 120k miles should sell for 10k tops in similar condition. The market seems to agree. I have actively considered three ZHP's.

- trig, blk, AT, 180k with dead cats per the dealer. Asking $8k for ~8 days.
- imola, naturalbwn, AT, 122k. Asking 11k and has been stagnant for 28 days on cars.com
- white, naturalbwn, AT 110k. Asking 13k and stagnant 23 days. I know you said there's accidents, but he doesn't state that and in my opinion prices it as if it has had minor to no accidents
- red, suedeblk, MT, 95k. Asked 14k - pulled listing after 30 days stagnant (I don't see it re-up anywhere). Maybe it sold, but the fact it expired and he was willing to do so much to help secure the deal with me implied to me that he decided he'd rather just keep it. I could ask but I would feel bad.

Then there's this that I don't consider: Taig, blk, MT, 75k. Asking 17k. Time listed is unknown, but up for at least 10 days.

I don't know how long a car should sit, but I believe 2+ weeks is when you should begin to worry about price. These are the anchors I use to gauge price. and value. With this anchors, I think $9k would be the right price for that one in Georgia.

Like excellent condition cars. excellent paint which you can only get with people that don't drive it and park in a garage. If you drive it, there's going to be rock chips and stuff. That's normal every day wear and tear.

Have you ever sold a car before? It takes awhile. I would say 1-3 months would be the normal. If it's sold in less than 2 weeks, it was priced way too low. And if it's sitting for 6 months or longer, either it's priced way too high, or there is something wrong with it and people keep passing on it (like that white one). Bid sites, that's a whole different thing. They get listed for like a week.

And the 2 ZHPs on carsandbids that you keep looking at. I'm not sure if you even looked at it, but they only went for that price because both of them were in accidents. They also have like all these imperfections that you would have screamed and called them trash by now. Else both of them would have totally be in the 12k range.


That black one feels like a really good value. I may send someone to look at it there's always wraps. First one is definitely wrapped. The wrap came out well though

That's what I thought. But then the details said it was painted. Won't know unless I see it in person. I would rip that shit off lol

[BH93]

I agree with sillieidiot.

@YoitsTmac

I'm not saying you should settle or that you should just scoop up the next one you find that's clean title, but you're looking at cars that are in the $7k-$14k range with over 100k miles. The focus of cars at that price point and mileage should be clean title, no accident history, no rust, and some trail of maintenance history. And if you want to spend a little more for the right color combination or transmission, then there's a premium to sprinkle on top.

Obviously people get lucky every once a in awhile and find an immaculate ZHP under priced, but realistically you're not going to find that. For the unicorns that do show up, you don't have the luxury to go get a PPI done and ponder about it because someone else will immediately scoop it up the same day...

I'm only mentioning this because it seems like you're getting a PPI done for cars you have interest in... but the way it usually works is, the good deals that people find are because they took a gamble and picked up the car before anyone else. Sometimes this pays off, and sometimes it doesn't... More people share the good news than the bad...

So I understand why you don't want to get burned again, but you can't have it both ways in that regard. 99% of the time, it's either a good deal with a calculated risk, or it's market price after looking over the entire car from an inspection.

I'm not trying to kick you down or anything... I've gone through the same hurdles as you when I picked up my car, but at a certain point I came to this realization that I was treating this ~10k clunker of a car with 6 digit miles on the odometer like it was a 10,000 mile Porsche.

[YoitsTmac]

No I don't feel down kicked. and @sillieidiot no, I have never sold my own car. I have sold a Prius in a day and a Camry in three weeks. I didn't know about the Cars and Bids structure either. I did look at the red cars' condition and didn't have an issue, I didn't know they were in accidents. All I can say is I have bought two cars in my life, and one was when I was still a kid at 17. I knew nothing. This is also my first "massive inflationary" period of my life (I'm 24 in two weeks :D ) and it's hard for me to come to terms with the value of these cars when my last E46 was so clean for under $5k with under 100k miles.

I'm also getting different information everywhere. You guys say I'm undervaluing, I have my SoCal chat and my small text group chat say I'm overvaluing. Tie that with my general lack of understanding of this hyperinflation probably tied with some (likely) increased scarcity, it's really hard to wrap my mind around value.

I'm also not saying the cars I'm looking at are shit. Again, just the way I was raised and trained to look at cars is to recognize all the flaws first. I don't nick the car in Georgia for having the glasses holder broken or the trim not flush, but I want to catch them. I don't want to be surprised. I want to level my expectations of what I'm buying. It doesn't mean I think the car is poor because of it, but just trying to fully understand the condition of the car. I don't mind paint chips. The red car in New Mexico I was concerned about though because in the video he sent me, there were like 4x the damage on my current E46 and it was only repainted four years ago. Just seems like a not-so-great paint job.

I digress. In regards to the Georgia car whom I will call today, the only real "issues" I see is the dealer reviews, potential lack of PPI allowed and I think the front bumper is pretty heavily scraped. I don't think that car is such a deal that it's worth skipping a PPI. I get it's a 15 year old car more or less and it happens, but I'm just noting it and I think it leaves some haggling room.

I am also looking at a non-ZHP white on brown for $7k with 140k miles. I can't get ahold of the buyer so it either sold or they just don't care to check that often. My message isn't even marked as read.


I'm only mentioning this because it seems like you're getting a PPI done for cars you have interest in... but the way it usually works is, the good deals that people find are because they took a gamble and picked up the car before anyone else. Sometimes this pays off, and sometimes it doesn't... More people share the good news than the bad...

The hardest advice I need to take. Just again, I was raised in a risk averse family, and it was double reinforced after my first car.


edit: this is almost spec for spec my car I just lost, as I bought it, with 10k more miles for double the price: https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=606265417&zip=95624

That's part of where my disconnect is.

[YoitsTmac]

On top of that FB white on brown car, I am also looking at this: https://losangeles.craigslist.org/sgv/ctd/d/pasadena-2006-bmw-series-financing/7391122725.html

What do YOU guys think that is worth?

[BH93]

Let's base-line here based on your original post.

Your non-negotiables.

Interior: Black Dash
Exterior: White, Red, Blue, Dark Silver
Clean body (Clean title, accident + rust free), Coupe, ZHP

Is this still accurate? If so, let's exclude any cars that don't meet this criteria when determining value.

[YoitsTmac]

Doesn’t have to be ZHP but preferred. I like mystic blue too. Can have accidents. They don’t scare me if I can see them or check subframe.

Clean body to me just means no dents. Should have clarified.

[BH93]

Doesn’t have to be ZHP but preferred. I like mystic blue too. Can have accidents. They don’t scare me if I can see them or check subframe.

Clean body to me just means no dents. Should have clarified.


Your search criteria is pretty wide considering the ZHP's and Non-ZHP's have varying price points.
At this point, you're looking for any E46 coupe that isn't black.

[YoitsTmac]

Your search criteria is pretty wide considering the ZHP's and Non-ZHP's have varying price points.
At this point, you're looking for any E46 coupe that isn't black.

No tAig, facelift (might as well). And the black dash. Yeah my search is nice and broad (feels that way)

[BH93]

No tAig, facelift (might as well). And the black dash. Yeah my search is nice and broad (feels that way)

So this is your new search criteria:

Any 2003+ E46 Coupe that is not tAig or black with clean title with black dash interior and no major damage to body.

What is your hard budget and are all mileage okay?
Do all the cars you've linked on here follow this criteria?

[YoitsTmac]

Any mileage okay. Would love sub 120k, probably a pretty firm ceiling at 140k

Budget semi firm at 12-13k. I’ll spend more for blue though.

[BH93]

Any mileage okay. Would love sub 120k, probably a pretty firm ceiling at 140k

Budget semi firm at 12-13k. I’ll spend more for blue though.

Updated search criteria:

Any 2003+ E46 Coupe engine/transmission spec
Clean Title, accident history okay, no major damage to body
Any exterior color except black or tiAg
Any interior color with black dash
<140k miles
<$13k

Any car that falls into this criteria, keep a list to compare values to and you can get a feel for what's a good price.
You've established your criteria, so don't make exceptions to this. Only keep track of what falls into this list.

To me, market price = what's available. If you can't buy it right now, then it's not market.

[YoitsTmac]

And 330* sorry. There’s tons of 325’s

Totally fair on market price. But it’s also what it’ll sell for in my opinion.

[BH93]

And 330* sorry. There’s tons of 325’s

Totally fair on market price. But it’s also what it’ll sell for in my opinion.

Updated search criteria:

Any 2003+ E46 330i Coupe
Clean Title, accident history okay, no major damage to body
Any exterior color except black or tiAg
Any interior color with black dash
<140k miles
<$13k

You've already said you're willing to spend up to $13k for a car that checks all your boxes, so what it'll sell for is not important because you've already established your budget.

[sillieidiot]

No I don't feel down kicked. and @sillieidiot no, I have never sold my own car. I have sold a Prius in a day and a Camry in three weeks. I didn't know about the Cars and Bids structure either. I did look at the red cars' condition and didn't have an issue, I didn't know they were in accidents. All I can say is I have bought two cars in my life, and one was when I was still a kid at 17. I knew nothing. This is also my first "massive inflationary" period of my life (I'm 24 in two weeks :D ) and it's hard for me to come to terms with the value of these cars when my last E46 was so clean for under $5k with under 100k miles.


Yeah because the stuff that you point out in cars prior that you didn't like, they all have them. Rock chips on hood/bumper, scrapes on front/rear/sides skirts, headliner peeling, one of the car has dents, clear coat failure, accidents, etc. Like one of your main things that you were really going on about was paint quality. So how does clear coat failure pass your criteria wtf?



I'm also getting different information everywhere. You guys say I'm undervaluing, I have my SoCal chat and my small text group chat say I'm overvaluing. Tie that with my general lack of understanding of this hyperinflation probably tied with some (likely) increased scarcity, it's really hard to wrap my mind around value.

edit: this is almost spec for spec my car I just lost, as I bought it, with 10k more miles for double the price: https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=606265417&zip=95624

That's part of where my disconnect is.


If you are looking at ZHPs, you are undervaluing them currently. The prices you are expecting is pre-pandemic prices which has them maxing out like at 13k for an excellent condition car. Prices now are like 3k higher. This is a bad time to buy ZHPs or any car with a cult following.

If you're look at normal 330s, then you are overvaluing them lol

And because you are looking for just 330s in general, that's why the prices are all over the place.



I'm also not saying the cars I'm looking at are shit. Again, just the way I was raised and trained to look at cars is to recognize all the flaws first. I don't nick the car in Georgia for having the glasses holder broken or the trim not flush, but I want to catch them. I don't want to be surprised. I want to level my expectations of what I'm buying. It doesn't mean I think the car is poor because of it, but just trying to fully understand the condition of the car. I don't mind paint chips. The red car in New Mexico I was concerned about though because in the video he sent me, there were like 4x the damage on my current E46 and it was only repainted four years ago. Just seems like a not-so-great paint job.


Yeah could be bad paint job. Or if you know the state well, NM has a shitload of rocks on their highways.



I digress. In regards to the Georgia car whom I will call today, the only real "issues" I see is the dealer reviews, potential lack of PPI allowed and I think the front bumper is pretty heavily scraped. I don't think that car is such a deal that it's worth skipping a PPI. I get it's a 15 year old car more or less and it happens, but I'm just noting it and I think it leaves some haggling room.

I am also looking at a non-ZHP white on brown for $7k with 140k miles. I can't get ahold of the buyer so it either sold or they just don't care to check that often. My message isn't even marked as read.


Like I said, don't trust dealers at all lol And yeah it's not that great of a deal. It's just one of the cars that we think are the better conditioned ones that you were looking at (at least through pics). But yeah I'd walk away from that one if they won't do PPI.

They could also be scammers lol Just took your phone number so they can send you spam texts lol

there's this non-zhp
https://orangecounty.craigslist.org/cto/d/costa-mesa-2004-bmw-series/7391033830.html

It's just posted. I saw it on offer up, but it's on CL now too I guess.

edit:
damn doesn't have black dash

[sillieidiot]

Imma throw another wrench into things while I'm at it.

Prices between dealer vs. private party are different too. Basically if you're looking at dealer, it's going to always be higher than a comparable car for private party. Plus taxes and fees. Usually for used cars, when you haggle them, you'll still end up paying the listed price in total lol

The other thing has to do with mileage. I know you're keeping it at <140k. But the type of mileage on the car matters too. Like if they were like 80% highway. That car would be more preferable to 80% city. City driving is really harsh on the car. Like if you were looking at 120k city car vs. 140k highway car (all other conditions the same), I would lean favorably to the highway car. More miles, but the car worked less. Try to ask the sellers that when you contact them. Just in case find a car that has everything you want, but the mileage is outside your criteria. If it's highway, I would seriously consider it.


Updated search criteria:

Any 2003+ E46 330i Coupe
Clean Title, accident history okay, no major damage to body
Any exterior color except black or tiAg
Any interior color with black dash
<140k miles
<$13k

You've already said you're willing to spend up to $13k for a car that checks all your boxes, so what it'll sell for is not important because you've already established your budget.

Tyler, you think you could just put that in your first post? lol Just like how he has it. Just so it's easier to find. This thread is way too long. I know it's my fault with my long ass novels lol

[YoitsTmac]

I have purchased a car. Pics to come soon :)

[fredo]

Congrats, man ! In for pics. :thumbsup

[holyc0w]

I have purchased a car. Pics to come soon :)

Nice, is it a Honda Civic Si?

[YoitsTmac]

Nice, is it a Honda Civic Si?

Better. 94’ accord. It even has a sunroof so very well equipped.

Definitely soon to be a classic.

[sillieidiot]

nice, the search is over. Move along people lol

[YoitsTmac]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211010/0c2f3176c3d4bbe14fa1ce22d232fc1d.jpg
Just a tease for now.

There seems to be an odd weight to the wheel when at rest. Will have to look into it. Could be nothing, maybe just been a while

[fredo]

So far, so good : OEM wheel style 135.

[sillieidiot]

You have a flip phone? that is the blurriest car picture ever :rofl

[YoitsTmac]

You have a flip phone? that is the blurriest car picture ever :rofl

I focused on the key. It’s a tease photo!

[cody_94]

Can't wait to see what you got!

[YoitsTmac]

Sorry guys. Such a long day. I went from physical therapy to there, I’m still hurting from my accident. And now that I’m home I’m watching F1. Nonetheless, here’s my favorite picture :)https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211010/d785fb1409083b56abc37c48512b0877.jpg

[holyc0w]

Very nice

What's the interior color? Brown or Tan?

[YoitsTmac]

Very nice

What's the interior color? Brown or Tan?

Natural brown!
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20211010/0c1b88256bff852ddb7bd65e6c5adbdd.jpg

[John in VA]

You're missing a pedal! :p

[YoitsTmac]

I know I know! I keep clutching in when I turn it off. Shifting to park isn’t even in my muscle memory. Once my back is better, I’m pulling the manual out of my old car (and lsd, sways, coils) and putting it in the new one

[t.er]

Glad to hear it worked out! Very nice combo. Also glad to hear you get to keep all your old go-fast bits

Sent from my SM-G781W using Tapatalk

[sillieidiot]

nice, looks good. nice to see another AW coupe.

[BMWCurves]

Congrats on the purchase!

[fredo]

Well done. IMO, that's the best combo out there (AW on NB).

[Will]

Congrats, that's a good looking coupe!

[YoitsTmac]

Thank you guys for the kind words. I did cheat in the photo. Oddly enough the diffuser is painted white, but seems like a cheap change. Also the mirror isn’t auto-dimming, but thankfully I know a car that does have one :)

Definitely will have to get a build thread going. This thing is going to be turned to 11 real fast.

[BH93]

Thank you guys for the kind words. I did cheat in the photo. Oddly enough the diffuser is painted white, but seems like a cheap change. Also the mirror isn’t auto-dimming, but thankfully I know a car that does have one :)

Definitely will have to get a build thread going. This thing is going to be turned to 11 real fast.

Nice pick up!
Was this on your list of cars you've shared before? Or is this coming out of left field and you jumped on it?

[YoitsTmac]

Nice pick up!
Was this on your list of cars you've shared before? Or is this coming out of left field and you jumped on it?

A brief skim through here leads me to believe I saw this before I made this thread. It was overpriced for what it was. After a month with no car and some PPI’s, seeing potential shipping or flights to grab a car, I decided I could pay more to avoid those otherwise costly requirements to purchasing a car further. Meanwhile he sat on it with medium interest for about a month, so he was willing to let it go for a little less.

Me willing to move up and him willing to move down, we were able to meet in the middle at a price we were both happy with.

[BH93]

A brief skim through here leads me to believe I saw this before I made this thread. It was overpriced for what it was. After a month with no car and some PPI’s, seeing potential shipping or flights to grab a car, I decided I could pay more to avoid those otherwise costly requirements to purchasing a car further. Meanwhile he sat on it with medium interest for about a month, so he was willing to let it go for a little less.

Me willing to move up and him willing to move down, we were able to meet in the middle at a price we were both happy with.

Care to share the details? MY? mileage? Options? Price?

[YoitsTmac]

Care to share the details? MY? mileage? Options? Price?

2006 BMW 330Ci ZHP with 116k. Alpine White on Natural Brown, AT. No other packages it seems (no lumbar, no auto dim mirror, no heated seats).

Price, sub 11k. About as specific as I want to get with price :). This is the biggest purchase in my life at 23, so it feels a little sensitive to get more specific.

[BH93]

2006 BMW 330Ci ZHP with 116k. Alpine White on Natural Brown, AT. No other packages it seems (no lumbar, no auto dim mirror, no heated seats).

Price, sub 11k. About as specific as I want to get with price :). This is the biggest purchase in my life at 23, so it feels a little sensitive to get more specific.

I would say this is the best combination. Last MY, natural brown interior, and AW.
You can retrofit the heated seats pretty easily. 3 wires each seat connector to center console + need to pull off heater elements from donor seats and into yours.

[fredo]

Only 29 ZHP Coupes AW on NB were made : 10 MT and 19 AT.

[YoitsTmac]

Thanks for the congrats on the combo. Not sure if I said it here, but I purchased a natural brown interior in anticipation of buying a car without it. I have a great solution for the heated seats dilemma :)