First Impressions on Track: My 2005 ZHP takes its maiden voyage around Texas World Speedway

[AggieBlake]

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Can I find a four-door manual sedan for under $15k that can take the kids to school during the week and then hold its own on track during the weekend? That’s the question that led me to purchase an ’05 6-speed ZHP two months ago. It has excelled at taking the kids to school (and looking good doing it), but how would it fair running side-by-side with the GT3’s, ZR1’s, M3’s, and Miatas that crowd our local track every weekend? I had a chance to find out this weekend as I took both the ZHP and my ’96 Miata track rat out to Texas World Speedway, a 2.9 mile, 15-turn road course with a mix of fast sweepers, on and off-camber banked turns, a 180 deg carousel, and a front straight that uses a portion of the high-bank Nascar oval. Here's a track map for those who've never had the pleasure to drive it.

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A little background: I’ve done approximately 10 HPDE events - most at TWS. I’m not a newbie, but definitely not advanced/instructor level either. So this isn’t a Randy Pobst or Chris Harris kind of review. I’m just your average HPDE enthusiast. I’ve driven an NC Miata and a 5th gen Mustang on track, but my primary track toy is this heavily modified NA Miata (suspension, brakes, safety, engine, and r-comps).

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I started the day with three sessions in the Miata in damp, 42 degree weather. I was on fairly old NT01’s. It was like driving on ice. Lots of opposite-lock practice! In good weather, the Miata is a champ in the corners and an easy target on the straights. But I love driving it - feels like a go-kart that will do 100+! It’s extremely direct thanks to it’s taught track suspension and lack of either traction control or anti-lock brakes. Since it’s not my daily driver, I can flog it without fear. I’ve had numerous off-track “experiences” over the last couple years, but have since then gained what I would consider pretty good car control skills.

By 11am I was ready to switch to the ZHP. It has 98k miles and I’ve done a bunch of preventative maintenance including VCG, OFHG, full coolant rebuild, and brakes. It’s stock other than an AFE Stage 1 intake, Stewart hi-flo water pump, and Motul RBF 600 brake fluid. Let me start with a disclaimer: I left the traction control on all day. The car was brand new to me, the conditions were not at all ideal, and the track was crowded… and I’ve got to take the kids to school in this on Monday. So I sacrificed a bit of speed and some dynamic feel to go a safer route. The good news: the traction control was surprisingly unobtrusive and effective. I expected a car designed 16+ years ago to suffer from a rather unsophisticated system. I was wrong. It intervened only at the right moments. I had only one obtrusive intervention towards the end of the day while laying down power on a corner exit, but that was one time out of two full hours of high speed driving. That said, the traction control did prevent me from hanging the car on it’s limits like I can with the Miata, costing some lap time and enjoyment.

So now that we’ve started, let’s continue with the good. First and foremost, I simply cannot imagine a better calibrated dual-duty suspension that is not adjustable. I drove nuked roads in downtown Houston last week, then a couple hours on a butter-smooth highway, and then two hours of fast laps on track. The car was excellent in all three environments. Could it be better? Yes. It could be softer downtown, quieter on the highway, stiffer on the track… but if you want it to do well in all three, this suspension is superb. There was little roll on track and it took a set quickly for a stock suspension. It absorbed rough patches flawlessly. My biggest complaint is that like all modern cars it’s skewed towards understeer. I plan to move to a squared tire set-up which will help mitigate understeer. Adjustable dampers or a stiffer rear anti-roll bar would also help. But to be honest, the understeer was not as much as I expected for a stock sedan. Up to 9/10ths the car felt neutral, and I could counter understeer with judicious use of trail braking, particularly in the tight carousel turn 10.

Now to rate driver inputs. Steering: what can I say other than flawless? It’s my favorite I’ve ever interacted with. It has just the right amount of weight, centers well, and the ratio feels excellent. I was impressed. Sadly, the same cannot be said for the brakes. The fluid upgrade helped prevent fade, but the brakes lacked the bite I’m used to from the Hawk and Carbotech pads I’ve used. Braking effort took longer to build than I would prefer, and I did not have the feedback in the pedal at the limit that I expected. This is certainly not a surprise - you can’t expect track performance from pads designed for daily driving. But I believe this car would really benefit from a set of spare track pads and rotors that can be switched out before HPDE weekends. As for the throttle, I actually liked the responsiveness on track. While the throttle rate feels slower than I’d like on the street, it was ideal on the track for smoothing out my inputs and maintaining traction. My one complaint with the throttle is that I’m not used to a bottom-pivot pedal and it made heel-toe shifting difficult for me (which was exacerbated by an overly mute engine note - more on that shortly). Finally, I love this transmission, shifter, and clutch! I deleted the clutch delay valve last week and have NO regrets at all. The clutch now feels predictable and consistent under hard driving. I’m also using the BMW performance shift knob which is a little shorter than stock and felt a little more direct to me as a result. TWS is a 3rd and 4th gear track for this car, and I was able to move between these gears under load without any trouble even at redline.

While I appreciate modern automotive design, I hate when design trumps driver visibility. Fortunately that was not an issue in this car. The cockpit was created with spirited driving in mind and the result is excellent visibility in all directions. I had no trouble seeing the GT3’s closing from the rear. Gauges were also easy to read. But now for my biggest complaint: when this car is at its limits, the driver-restraint is not at all adequate. I’m exactly medium height and build and weigh 155 pounds. The seats feel wonderful on the road, but are not nearly tight enough on track. I could barely hold myself in place in high-speed sweepers. If this car sees more track time I will definitely be investing in a harness and removable harness bar so I can strap myself in tightly. Until then, there’s no reason to improve the car’s cornering ability. It’s already driver limited :)

Finally, what about power? Most people would not consider a 330i “fast,” at least not compared to typical track cars. That’s true; I can attest that it’s no match for GT3’s or C7’s on the straights. But most of the track isn’t straight, and in the corners this car did exceptionally well for a stock sedan. With an aftermarket suspension and r-comp tires (and the aforementioned driver restraint improvements) I am confident it could hold its own in the turns. Since easily ⅔ of the TWS track is traction-limited, not power-limited for cars like this, that means that additional power would be of little benefit for the majority of a lap. On the straights a ZHP will get passed, but not nearly as quickly as my Miata. On the front straight at TWS my Miata hits it’s terminal velocity of ~105. The high-power Vettes and Porsches will reach 145. I did 125 in the ZHP - right in the middle of the pack. It never felt slow. The ZHP truly felt like it belonged on track. The engine pulled hard when I needed it, lap after lap, for two solid hours. I attached a scan gauge to monitor coolant temps (why don’t cars come with better coolant, oil temp, and oil pressure gauges!?) and the car ran a cool 190+/-5 most of the day in 45 degree ambient air. I was very pleased with every aspect of the driveline… except the sound. Even with the stage 1 AFE intake I could barely hear the engine. I rely on sound to judge RPM when I heel-toe since I can’t afford to look at the gauges in those crucial moments. But with the wind buffeting through the open windows (required on track) and the tires screeching at their limits, I couldn’t hear the engine at all. I will need to consider installing a louder exhaust before I get back out there.

Conclusion: My goal was to find a kindergarten shuttle that could hold its own on the track and cost less than $15k to purchase and $2k per year to maintain. I believe I’ve found the perfect match, my Huckleberry, in my ZHP. I love driving it downtown, on the highway, and now on track as well. It excels at what matters most to me: composure at the limits, cornering ability, and that impossible-to-measure thing we call “feel.” It felt GREAT to drive at its limits. What it lacks is largely fixable (harness bar, stronger track brakes, louder exhaust). It will never have the go-kart reflexes of a Miata or the blistering torque of a Viper, but neither of those will ever work as a kindergarten shuttle. So for a car that must do both school and track, there’s few that can compete at this price point with a ZHP.

[BMWCurves]

Very clear and well-stated review! I'm glad it met most of your expectations and was fun to drive on the track. I'm hoping to do a track day event at some point and look forward to it more every time I hear someone come back stating it's not a track animal, but a very track-capable car in near-stock form, one that rewards the skilled driver.

[AggieBlake]

You'll have a great time if you do! Your mods should make it even more engaging than mine. I do recommend waiting for warmer weather, however :) 45 degrees is borderline on performance tires. They were difficult to heat up.

[Karl Lazlo]

Bravo! Great post!

[Lorenzo]

Great write-up. Makes me proud of my recent ZHP purchase.

[Vas]

Thanks for sharing

[slater]

Can I find a four-door manual sedan for under $15k that can take the kids to school during the week and then hold its own on track during the weekend?

amen, brother! i feel the same way. best all-around car for family use for the budget-conscious enthusiast driver.



I left the traction control on all day. The car was brand new to me, the conditions were not at all ideal, and the track was crowded… and I’ve got to take the kids to school in this on Monday. So I sacrificed a bit of speed and some dynamic feel to go a safer route. The good news: the traction control was surprisingly unobtrusive and effective. I expected a car designed 16+ years ago to suffer from a rather unsophisticated system. I was wrong. It intervened only at the right moments.

yep. i find it a bit intrusive in the dry, but in the snow it's fantastic. i'm not sure if you realize it's a 2-stage system; pressing the DSC button disables DSC; if you hold down the DSC button for 5 seconds, it will disengage DSC and DTC. i like just having DSC off.



My biggest complaint is that like all modern cars it’s skewed towards understeer. I plan to move to a squared tire set-up which will help mitigate understeer. Adjustable dampers or a stiffer rear anti-roll bar would also help. But to be honest, the understeer was not as much as I expected for a stock sedan. Up to 9/10ths the car felt neutral, and I could counter understeer with judicious use of trail braking, particularly in the tight carousel turn 10.

i upgraded my bars to OE 26/20mm bars and i like them, but i think my alignment helped a lot too - i'm running -1.5 degrees camber up front and -0.75 degrees in the rear. much better turn-in.



Finally, I love this transmission, shifter, and clutch! I deleted the clutch delay valve last week and have NO regrets at all. The clutch now feels predictable and consistent under hard driving.

same here - just did the CDV delete, and i love the clutch engagement now. much smoother.



But now for my biggest complaint: when this car is at its limits, the driver-restraint is not at all adequate. I’m exactly medium height and build and weigh 155 pounds. The seats feel wonderful on the road, but are not nearly tight enough on track. I could barely hold myself in place in high-speed sweepers. If this car sees more track time I will definitely be investing in a harness and removable harness bar so I can strap myself in tightly. Until then, there’s no reason to improve the car’s cornering ability. It’s already driver limited :)

i felt the stock seats were very wide. i upgraded to M3 seats with adjustable kidney bolsters - MUCH better. you can adjust to your driving task.



Even with the stage 1 AFE intake I could barely hear the engine. I rely on sound to judge RPM when I heel-toe since I can’t afford to look at the gauges in those crucial moments. But with the wind buffeting through the open windows (required on track) and the tires screeching at their limits, I couldn’t hear the engine at all. I will need to consider installing a louder exhaust before I get back out there.

i would highly recommend M3 engine mounts and stiffer trans mounts (i'm using UUC, but lots of folks like the M3 mounts). this will transmit more noise into the cabin. i'm running a really locked down drivetrain (see my sig) and i get just the right amount of engine noise under load (read: a good amount), and it's quiet when cruising. perfect for me!

congrats and great write-up!

peter

[AggieBlake]

Great suggestions, Peter! Thanks, man. M3 seats and mounts - my wish-list is growing! And you're right, I was not aware of the DSC/DTC distinction. Time to do some research on that. Thanks for the tip.

[derbo]

Great post. I love tracking my ZHP and with the minor lack in power, it does make up in terms of performance after a few of those modifications you mentioned. One thing Miatas locally hate at Laguna Seca is getting passed on the back straight to the corkscrew like they were standing still while they can outcorner most cars out there.

Driver restraint, I would suggest Schroth QuickFit Pros which buckle into the car when needed and removable when driving the kids to school. Brake pads I would recommend pad swapping before track days but that maybe too much work. I used to swap rotors/pads for HPDE and used OE rotor/pads for daily driving. Exhaust noise = TSE3. Nuff said.

[AggieBlake]

Excellent! Thanks Derek. What pads are you running now that you're not swapping? I've loved the carbotech XP8's on the miata, but they're a bit squeaky for around town use. I'll check out the Schroth unit. And a TSE3 is definitely on the list. I'm hoping (unrealistically probably:)) to find one used somewhere. They are pricey.

Also I notice in your picture that you're running what looks like 17" Arc8's. Correct? I'm very interested in going that route with a squared set-up for better balance and easy tire rotation. I love the look of 18's but they are not nearly as practical as 17's (less rotational inertia, better damping, less expensive). You have any regrets going that route?

[3ZHP]

Nice wright-up. It's been a few years since my last driving school and reading this makes me want to go back.m[emoji6]

Added note on the pads.

I recently went with the new Hawk 5.0 HPS and have a significantly shorter brake distance, no noise and low dust. A little different feel without the initial bite but, very smooth and predictable response to pedal pressure.

Sent from my iPhone 6S using Tapatalk

[slater]

Great suggestions, Peter! Thanks, man. M3 seats and mounts - my wish-list is growing! And you're right, I was not aware of the DSC/DTC distinction. Time to do some research on that. Thanks for the tip.

no problem. here's an in-car video of my car, it's hard to tell how loud the engine noise is, as i recorded it with my iPhone. but it's just the right amount.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4EoUDx5afk



Also I notice in your picture that you're running what looks like 17" Arc8's. Correct? I'm very interested in going that route with a squared set-up for better balance and easy tire rotation. I love the look of 18's but they are not nearly as practical as 17's (less rotational inertia, better damping, less expensive). You have any regrets going that route?

i know you posed this question to derek, but i went to 17" Style 68s. 20lbs per wheel, they are staggered though. no regrets. they don't look as good as the 18's but everything else is better!

[BMWCurves]

Great suggestions, Peter! Thanks, man. M3 seats and mounts - my wish-list is growing! And you're right, I was not aware of the DSC/DTC distinction. Time to do some research on that. Thanks for the tip.

Both are on my list of to-do things as well. I really want M3 seats for the added support and comfort.


Great suggestions, Peter! Thanks, man. M3 seats and mounts - my wish-list is growing! And you're right, I was not aware of the DSC/DTC distinction. Time to do some research on that. Thanks for the tip.

For a quick break down on the distinctions between the two (taken from the source linked below):
Dynamic Stability Control (DSC) is the default operation for your car's stability and traction control systems. Dynamic Traction Control (DTC) is a different system, where moderate wheelspin is allowed, in order to gain traction in slippery road conditions. To engage DTC, and take the car out of DSC, press the button on the center console. You will have the ability to spin the tires slightly, but your stability control will be in your hands. By holding the button down, your car eliminates the availability of both systems.

In summary:

By default: DSC = ON, DTC = OFF
1 press turns DTC ON (slip icon is lit in the gauge cluster.)
3 sec press = both systems disengaged (both the slip icon and the "brake" icon are lit on the gauge cluster)

Braking functions (ABS, ABD, etc) are not impacted in either mode.

Source: http://www.bimmerforums.com/forum/showthread.php?925331-E9x-FAQ-amp-Useful-Threads-(READ-ME-before-posting-a-question)&p=12012316#post12012316


Excellent! Thanks Derek. What pads are you running now that you're not swapping? I've loved the carbotech XP8's on the miata, but they're a bit squeaky for around town use. I'll check out the Schroth unit. And a TSE3 is definitely on the list. I'm hoping (unrealistically probably:)) to find one used somewhere. They are pricey.

Also I notice in your picture that you're running what looks like 17" Arc8's. Correct? I'm very interested in going that route with a squared set-up for better balance and easy tire rotation. I love the look of 18's but they are not nearly as practical as 17's (less rotational inertia, better damping, less expensive). You have any regrets going that route?

I can't answer for Derek (Derbo), but I and I think Daniel (NoVaPhotog) are planning to go the route of Apex ARC-8s in 17", for the reasons you cited. I emailed Apex a couple of months ago and they said they were planning to do a group buy for 17" ARC-8s shortly after the new year. Just a heads up if you want to get them on discount!

[Rovert]

Glad you had a great time on the track! The ZHP is a fun vehicle at the track even if it is a heavier track car compared to most. It's balance of the chassis just allows the driver to experience something great and stable.

Let me clarify the traction control system so it's dead simple to understand as I have played with it countless times in all climates.

By default the car won't allow rear wheel spin by using the rear brakes or adjust engine timing to lower power output. By default it also uses the brakes to control mild to moderate understeer and oversteer. If you really step over the law of physics, your understeer or oversteer will just be minimized before you crash.

One press, the amber triangle:
- Allows rear wheel spin (when wheel is pointed straight) which you normally use in the snow to get out of a stuck spot. If you understeer or oversteer, the system will intervene and keep you in check. Because this mode allows wheel spin, you may oversteer a little bit more than default settings before the system attempts a recovery.

Hold press, the yellow triangle + yellow brake light:
- Allows rear wheel spin and allows you to understeer/oversteer to your heart's content.

[AggieBlake]

Very helpful everyone! I have a couple questions. First, from what I'm reading in the DSC/DTC links you all sent, the systems only differ under 42mph. After that you still have all systems functioning unless you've fully disabled both. Correct? Peter, are you noticing a difference b/w DSC and DTC at track speeds? Even in the slowest corners I'm not dropping below that threshold.

I would love in on the Apex 17" group buy if I can swing the price. Anyone know what discounts typically run? I have my set of practically perfect ZHP wheels with ⅔ life Mich PSS. Any ideas what these tend to sell for? As much as I'd like to keep them, I'm probably going to be money limited and will need to sell them to offset the cost of 17" wheels and tires.

[NoVAphotog]

I and I think Daniel (NoVaPhotog) are planning to go the route of Apex ARC-8s in 17", for the reasons you cited. I emailed Apex a couple of months ago and they said they were planning to do a group buy for 17" ARC-8s shortly after the new year. Just a heads up if you want to get them on discount!

+1

I love this thread. Thanks for your thoughts and impressions Blake! The ZHP is the best all-around car you can get for the price by far. Timeless looks, ability to pull double duty for the practical enthusiast right out of the box, not too fast, not too slow, did I mention sexy?

I definitely have my eye on those ARC-8's if they get around to having the group buy, as of now they have one up for the 19" wheels...not a fan.

I'll definitely be coming back with some impressions myself in the Spring/early Summer. Since my car will no longer be a DD, I definitely want to get an HPDE or two in. Either at VIR or Summit Point, preference is for VIR...because VIR.

Planning on having the Bilstein PSS installed by then coupled with the LSD (awesome by the way!) and hopefully the ARC-8's... :roundel

[AggieBlake]

Yep, a LSD is definitely on the list, but a bit further down. One day!

I hope you do VIR - that's on my bucket list along with Leguna Seca.

[BMWCurves]

Very helpful everyone! I have a couple questions. First, from what I'm reading in the DSC/DTC links you all sent, the systems only differ under 42mph. After that you still have all systems functioning unless you've fully disabled both. Correct? Peter, are you noticing a difference b/w DSC and DTC at track speeds? Even in the slowest corners I'm not dropping below that threshold.

I would love in on the Apex 17" group buy if I can swing the price. Anyone know what discounts typically run? I have my set of practically perfect ZHP wheels with ⅔ life Mich PSS. Any ideas what these tend to sell for? As much as I'd like to keep them, I'm probably going to be money limited and will need to sell them to offset the cost of 17" wheels and tires.

The 18" group buy had $50 off per wheel and free shipping, so I imagine the 17" would be around the same, maybe a bit less?

As for your Style 135 wheels and tires, depends on the condition but you can definitely get several hundred bucks for them. I haven't actually watched the price of what they're selling for (I should since my father's thinking about selling his set), but someone else with better knowledge can help you out with a proper starting price.

[derbo]

Excellent! Thanks Derek. What pads are you running now that you're not swapping? I've loved the carbotech XP8's on the miata, but they're a bit squeaky for around town use. I'll check out the Schroth unit. And a TSE3 is definitely on the list. I'm hoping (unrealistically probably:)) to find one used somewhere. They are pricey.

Also I notice in your picture that you're running what looks like 17" Arc8's. Correct? I'm very interested in going that route with a squared set-up for better balance and easy tire rotation. I love the look of 18's but they are not nearly as practical as 17's (less rotational inertia, better damping, less expensive). You have any regrets going that route?

I don't daily drive my ZHP so I have carbotech XP12s in the front and XP8 in the rear (waiting for them to die before upgrading to a stronger pad in the rear). I'm actually thinking about going to PFC06 or PFC08s but thats about $600+ for brake pads..

You are correct. I do have 17s.

Specs are:
17x8.5 +40
245/40/17 Dunlop Star Spec Z1s

I love the 17 square setup. Tires are FAR cheaper. ie. My next tire is an RE71R 255/40/17 at $758 from Tirerack. Same tire in 255/35/18 is $1070. :) I'm just happy my stoptech BBK in the front clears the 17s and still have a good amount of tread available.


Here is the link to the Schroth. It's a bit pricey but for a daily driver this is ideal. I used to use this and it was good but I moved onto a bucket seat.

http://store.bimmerworld.com/schroth-quick-fit-pro-4-point-harness-p1125.aspx

[slater]

great new sig pic, derek! :cheers

[SoCalZman]

Great points. I look forward to getting my car on the track at some point.

I actually have read a few places by contemporary car reviewers about how sophisticated and awesome the E46 stability system was. It gave me the impression that it was a "ahead of its time/competition" system that the engineers really nailed.

I agree the seats are not grippy enough even in my day to day freeway ramp corner attacks. I didnt know the M3 seats were so much better (they looked like big lounger type chairs, haha). Might have to look into that. But first I MUST replace my steering wheel. So over alcantara.

[AggieBlake]

Derek, thanks for the link on the Schroth belt. I didn't know such a product existed. I've seen plenty of bolt in harness bars in 3-series cars, but never this. It's not that pricey when you consider that it's all I'd have to buy! I assume you can really get it tight (I'm used to a 6-point - never tried a 4-point).

And to all of you, thanks for the wheel recommendations. I think I'm sold on the square 17" x 8.5" Apex when they come out for group buy... unless I can find good quality used ones first. Anyone with Arc-8's looking for stock ZHP's with good tread MPSS to trade ;)

Thanks to everyone for the kind words and helpful feedback. Love this forum!! Now to earn some extra money. Must. Buy. Many. Parts.

[BMWCurves]

@AggieBlake

You might also consider these wheels/tires from another member: http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?17123-FS-17x8-5-D-Force-LTW5-w-Dunlop-Star-Spec-ZII-245-40-17-set-of-4-(Northern-IN)


Great points. I look forward to getting my car on the track at some point.

I actually have read a few places by contemporary car reviewers about how sophisticated and awesome the E46 stability system was. It gave me the impression that it was a "ahead of its time/competition" system that the engineers really nailed.

I agree the seats are not grippy enough even in my day to day freeway ramp corner attacks. I didnt know the M3 seats were so much better (they looked like big lounger type chairs, haha). Might have to look into that. But first I MUST replace my steering wheel. So over alcantara.

Consider the one Johnrando and I have! Check it out:
http://i.imgur.com/Kj1ppgb.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/lJo5jlo.jpg

[SoCalZman]

that is from Colby wheel, right?

[BMWCurves]

that is from Colby wheel, right?

Negative. It's from a company in California called DCT Motorsports (or something similar). It cost me $349 + shipping (plus an additional $199 core fee if you prefer to go that route. I did, and it was a painless process, received my refund about 4-5 days after I shipped it back to them). I am very pleased with it. It is a little thicker than our wheels, but I now prefer it. More info can be found in my project thread here: http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?15714-William-s-330Ci-ZHP-Maintenance-and-Project-Thread&p=431923#post431923

[derbo]

great new sig pic, derek! :cheers

Hahah thanks. I love it too. It actually looks better cropped as a sig than it does in its full glory.


Derek, thanks for the link on the Schroth belt. I didn't know such a product existed. I've seen plenty of bolt in harness bars in 3-series cars, but never this. It's not that pricey when you consider that it's all I'd have to buy! I assume you can really get it tight (I'm used to a 6-point - never tried a 4-point).

And to all of you, thanks for the wheel recommendations. I think I'm sold on the square 17" x 8.5" Apex when they come out for group buy... unless I can find good quality used ones first. Anyone with Arc-8's looking for stock ZHP's with good tread MPSS to trade ;)

Thanks to everyone for the kind words and helpful feedback. Love this forum!! Now to earn some extra money. Must. Buy. Many. Parts.


If you don't want HANS capability, you can get the quick-fit regular instead of the pro. It's about $100 cheaper but is more like a buckle. The harness provides adequate upper body restraint but it doesn't give too much lower body restraint as that is usually done by seat bolsters. It is still way better than stock seatbelts and I like it alot. It can clip your belly fat if you aren't too careful. ;)

Here is the link the non-pro.
http://store.bimmerworld.com/schroth-quick-fit-4-point-harness-p1126.aspx

I think 17x8.5 is a good choice for clearance and ability to get 255 under those arches. I want 17x9 now..but thats I think clearance becomes slightly an issue for some cars.

[AggieBlake]

Wow, Derek, I just read your build thread (about 20 pages of it). You are WAY out my league, man. Great stuff! Love the videos from Leguna Seca. That's my dream. Wish it weren't so far from Texas.

If you ever decide to upgrade to 17x9 apex and want to sell those 17x8.5, just let me know. My goals for this car are not likely to require fatter tires than that.

[AggieBlake]

Here I am in turn 10, the carousel. It's a slow, tight 180 - almost like a penalty box for anything other than the Radicals and Wolfs that blow us all away. This is early in the turn, heading towards a very late apex. The ZHP did reasonably well in this turn, but the Miata definitely had it beat here. This is where light, short wheel base cars thrive.
23646

[Rovert]

Just go for style and throw the tail out in it. It'll make for great on track entertainment for Miatas trying to get passed you. LOL

[Lorenzo]

@AggieBlake

You might also consider these wheels/tires from another member: http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?17123-FS-17x8-5-D-Force-LTW5-w-Dunlop-Star-Spec-ZII-245-40-17-set-of-4-(Northern-IN)



Consider the one Johnrando and I have! Check it out:
http://i.imgur.com/Kj1ppgb.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/lJo5jlo.jpg

Wow that is an awesome looking and I bet great feeling wheel. Too bad I just did new alcantara w/Coby. Oh well.

[derbo]

Wow, Derek, I just read your build thread (about 20 pages of it). You are WAY out my league, man. Great stuff! Love the videos from Leguna Seca. That's my dream. Wish it weren't so far from Texas.

If you ever decide to upgrade to 17x9 apex and want to sell those 17x8.5, just let me know. My goals for this car are not likely to require fatter tires than that.

thanks! I'm no means way out of your league. I only have about 18 HPDE events since 2010. I never messed with R-Comps either so that level of traction will be interesting to play with! Texas World Speedway definitely looks like a fun track that loads up suspension and any tire traction improvement would shave off laptimes by alot.

You know I want to track COTA but its about a 25hr drive... not so sure I want to do that.

[BMWCurves]

Wow that is an awesome looking and I bet great feeling wheel. Too bad I just did new alcantara w/Coby. Oh well.

The grass is always greener, I suppose. I'm sure your new alcantara wheel is just as good. My original alcantara wheel was in poor condition when I bought the car. I went with leather when I rewrapped it because it looks and feels great, but mainly I didn't want to have to deal with the upkeep of keeping the alcantara clean. The added benefit of alcantara is it's much better in extreme temperatures: not too cold on your hands when it's freezing and doesn't scald your skin when it's been sitting in the summer heat. I'm lazily looking for a cheap spare core so that I can have that wrapped in alcantara by Coby. That way I can swap them in and out as I please :)

[SoCalZman]

The grass is always greener, I suppose. I'm sure your new alcantara wheel is just as good. My original alcantara wheel was in poor condition when I bought the car. I went with leather when I rewrapped it because it looks and feels great, but mainly I didn't want to have to deal with the upkeep of keeping the alcantara clean. The added benefit of alcantara is it's much better in extreme temperatures: not too cold on your hands when it's freezing and doesn't scald your skin when it's been sitting in the summer heat. I'm lazily looking for a cheap spare core so that I can have that wrapped in alcantara by Coby. That way I can swap them in and out as I please :)

How much you looking to spend? Mine is in decent condition for its age. Like you I am just over trying to keep it clean.

[slater]

Like you I am just over trying to keep it clean.

same here. i sold mine and picked up a really clean leather M3 wheel on ebay - however, be warned that there is a lot of really worn wheels out there on ebay. i was fortunate to find a clean one for a good price. just takes patience, and really inspect the pics.

[BMWCurves]

How much you looking to spend? Mine is in decent condition for its age. Like you I am just over trying to keep it clean.

Really not much at all given I'd have to rewrap the wheel for $200. $50 tops. I'm just cruising part outs and the like to see if I can snap one up cheap.

@AggieBlake, sorry to derail the original topic of this thread!

[az3579]

Really not much at all given I'd have to rewrap the wheel for $200. $50 tops. I'm just cruising part outs and the like to see if I can snap one up cheap.

@AggieBlake, sorry to derail the original topic of this thread!
I've got a wheel you can have. Coby wouldn't take it because he still needs the foam to be intact. This wheel doesnt have it. It's completely stripped to the bare material. Let me know if you want it, just pay shipping.

Sent from my LG V10 on Tapatalk

[AggieBlake]

@AggieBlake, sorry to derail the original topic of this thread![/QUOTE]

No problem, it happens :)

I am one of those rare types who really loves an alcantara wheel. I spent about two hours cleaning mine with the DIY I found on this site (warm, damp towel, alancatara cleaner, magic eraser, lint cutter). It worked perfectly. I love it.

[SoCalZman]

same here. i sold mine and picked up a really clean leather M3 wheel on ebay - however, be warned that there is a lot of really worn wheels out there on ebay. i was fortunate to find a clean one for a good price. just takes patience, and really inspect the pics.

The M3 wheels are not that much new. Ill probably just buy a new one.


Really not much at all given I'd have to rewrap the wheel for $200. $50 tops. I'm just cruising part outs and the like to see if I can snap one up cheap.

@AggieBlake, sorry to derail the original topic of this thread!

Ah yeah mine is actually in too good of shape to need to be rewrapped so not what you are looking for. Goodluck.

And yes sorry for the threadjack. We get off on tangents when trying to help other members out. haha.

[BMWCurves]

I've got a wheel you can have. Coby wouldn't take it because he still needs the foam to be intact. This wheel doesnt have it. It's completely stripped to the bare material. Let me know if you want it, just pay shipping.

Hmm...tempting. Any idea would one go about getting foam back on it?


The M3 wheels are not that much new. Ill probably just buy a new one.



Ah yeah mine is actually in too good of shape to need to be rewrapped so not what you are looking for. Goodluck.

And yes sorry for the threadjack. We get off on tangents when trying to help other members out. haha.

Is yours the original alcantara or has it been rewrapped? If so, when? Actually, I'll PM you, it'll stop cluttering up Aggie's thread.

[BMWCurves]

For those in this thread interested in the Apex ARC-8s in 17" fitment, Apex's group buy is live and in the feeler stage. Maximum $150 discount with free shipping:

https://www.groupbuyparts.com/index.php/catalog/product/view/id/238/

Thanks FungShui for spotting this!

[ELCID86]

Thanks for sharing

+1 and Lorenzo needs a cdv delete... ;-)


---
"ZHP is a garbage option anyway- just some cosmetic upgrades with a different cam and diff to claw back some of the performance lost fitting those hideous and heavy wheels. Any 330 with a 3.46 diff will smoke a ZHP every time. The whole Mafia thing reeks of childish behavior." - an e46f member

[derbo]

@AggieBlake, sorry to derail the original topic of this thread!

No problem, it happens :)

I am one of those rare types who really loves an alcantara wheel. I spent about two hours cleaning mine with the DIY I found on this site (warm, damp towel, alancatara cleaner, magic eraser, lint cutter). It worked perfectly. I love it.[/QUOTE]

I like it cause my alcantara gloves from Sparco grip MUCH better on the alcantara wheel compared to a leather one. :)