Bedding & Posi-Quiet Ceramics

[orange260z]

So I just finished installing new Posi-Quiet Ceramics and Centric slotted & drilled rotors all around.

Should I be bedding these? Centric seems to suggest no; but I wonder if I should just follow the Stoptech procedure (some initial heat, then 8-10 repeated 60-20 brakings, then cool, then repeat).

Any thoughts? What have you other PQC owners done?

thanks

[mbeckel]

Stock rotors?

[orange260z]

new cross-drilled & slotted centrics.

[NoVAphotog]

So I just finished installing new Posi-Quiet Ceramics and Centric slotted & drilled rotors all around.

Should I be bedding these? Centric seems to suggest no; but I wonder if I should just follow the Stoptech procedure (some initial heat, then 8-10 repeated 60-20 brakings, then cool, then repeat).

Any thoughts? What have you other PQC owners done?

thanks

Bruce and I bedded them after install, yes. Just regular rotors though, but I don't think that makes a difference.

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[QC_ZHP]

I have the same setup and bedded mine.

[orange260z]

Ok, so I just went out and followed the stoptech bedding instructions twice. Feels great now, much better than before the bedding.

thanks all

[Smilez]

Should always bed them in. Especially when both surfaces are brand new

[orange260z]

Hi Ray, it made a big difference. I was worried when I took it for a quick first drive to remove the zinc coating, I felt that it felt "vibratey" and "grindey". When I went for my bedding run, that feeling decreased with each "stop", and was gone by the 4th or 5th. I did 10, drove for 5 mins at steady highway speeds, then did another set of 10, drove for another 5 mins and then came home and parked.

[derbo]

I bed in all brake pads, oem or not. Especially with new rotors and pads.

[Smilez]

Hi Ray, it made a big difference. I was worried when I took it for a quick first drive to remove the zinc coating, I felt that it felt "vibratey" and "grindey". When I went for my bedding run, that feeling decreased with each "stop", and was gone by the 4th or 5th. I did 10, drove for 5 mins at steady highway speeds, then did another set of 10, drove for another 5 mins and then came home and parked.

Yeah the first time with new surfaces, they tend to vibrate violently. Start to wonder did I install them wrong haha

[Imola.ZHP]

Is it ever too late to do bedding? I don't think I ever did.


--Marcus

[Smilez]

By now your surfaces should be adjacent to one another. On your next set of pads is best you do so.

[stephenkirsh]

What are the down sides to NOT bedding? For example, I doubt my fiance's brakes were bedded on her Accord.

[JupiterBMW]

On a vehicle that will never put the brakes into any serious action, it won't kill anything to NOT bed them... Is it preferred, sure, but if it was necessary, then shops would be required to do it. You can't expect the average consumer to know/care about anything like this... So will it hurt anything, no...

Now, if you plan to get them hot or do any "spirited" driving, then yes, bed them. Also, ideally you want to bleed afterward too. When I did the ZHP, I bedded them really well. 60-10 stops (10 of them) followed by 15 minutes of highway. Then I repeated that process. Then I came home and bled the system, including plugging in to INPA to activate the ABS and bleed that way as well. The pedal felt great, the brakes responded perfectly.

And of course, when you do get them hot, do not use the parking brake when you stop. Unless they are fully cool (more than 5 minutes of driving needed) you don't want to use the parking brake as that constant contact will hold the heat in that area...

Bedding is a good idea on a new set of brakes that you plan to drive aggressively. Would I bother doing it on my Mom's Camry? No.

[JupiterBMW]

Also, to the OP... Please post a review on the Posi-Quiet pads... I am considering them for the X5 as the OEM pads dust horribly, and my wife is complaining that the wheels get dirty too fast... :facepalm

I'd love to know what you think of them and how the dusting is.

[mbeckel]

Also, to the OP... Please post a review on the Posi-Quiet pads... I am considering them for the X5 as the OEM pads dust horribly, and my wife is complaining that the wheels get dirty too fast... :facepalm

I'd love to know what you think of them and how the dusting is.
Ray told me that BMW OEM rotors have a factor into that as well. When I went to my new brake setup. I went with the hawk pads because they dust wayyyyy less and have a little better clamping power. The stoptech were quieter, that did not matter to me IMO.

[JupiterBMW]

Yeah, I had Hawk pads years ago, didn't like them at all... I loved the Stoptech on my ZHP, but they don't have them for the X5M. I'm very limited it seems in selection... Of course, I could drop like $8k for a Brembo GT BBK... :eek

[mbeckel]

Yeah, I had Hawk pads years ago, didn't like them at all... I loved the Stoptech on my ZHP, but they don't have them for the X5M. I'm very limited it seems in selection... Of course, I could drop like $8k for a Brembo GT BBK... :eek
That's a bit steep! Good luck finding the RIGHT pads buddy.

[Smilez]

Or drop less for some R1concept big brake kit. * no he didnt*

[JupiterBMW]

Or drop less for some R1concept big brake kit. * no he didnt*

LOL... If I had any plans for the X other than my wife's vehicle, I might consider that, but honestly, BBKs are a complete waste of money for the driving we do. Good pads are more than adequate.

[fredo]

I have akebono ceramic pads on my e90. The dust problem is gone now. Not sure they are available for X5.

[orange260z]

Hey Joop,

I'm actually pretty disappointed with the PQs, and am thinking of switching them out and putting the old OEM pads back in. Although the dust is VERY low compared to the stock pads, the stopping power is almost as proportionately low. They just don't have any bite, and you have to push the pedal quite hard to get a decent rate of braking. I drive pretty aggressively and have always love the BMW brakes - not so much right now.

If anyone has any recommendations for a low-dust pad with high initial bite and aggressive braking, I'd love to know.

I'll probably throw my barely used PQs up for sale shortly.

[BCS_ZHP]

Also, to the OP... Please post a review on the Posi-Quiet pads... I am considering them for the X5 as the OEM pads dust horribly, and my wife is complaining that the wheels get dirty too fast... :facepalm

I'd love to know what you think of them and how the dusting is.

Jon,
The dealer did a warranty brake job on the x5 at 34K miles. We drove it home & I pulled the factory pads to replace with ceramics to eliminate the dust. Installed Akebano ceramics and zero dust, same stopping power as the factory set up. But the harder ceramic pads chewed up the factory blank rotors, they only lasted less than 25K miles. Was past the factory warranty so called Ray for some S&D rotors plus bought another set of Akebano ceramics. Stopping power now better than the factory set up, zero dust, quite happy with this combo.
Bruce

[orange260z]

Bruce, how is the initial bite with the Akebonos? Would you recommend them for an aggressively driven car?

[Vas]

I currently have Akebono euro pads on my zhp and don't like them. Should have spent the money on some hawk hps pads.

[orange260z]

Anyone have any recommendations that combine the bit of OEM with low dust? I HATE cleaning the 135s!!!

[BCS_ZHP]

Bruce, how is the initial bite with the Akebonos? Would you recommend them for an aggressively driven car?

I don't think any ceramic pad is going to make you happy for aggressive driving, they can't dissipate the heat as well as composite pads and will fade. Had pretty good performance from a Hawk composite low dust pad before, don't recall the name of them. I was just recommending the Akebonos to Joop for his x5 cause the stock pads on the e70 dust up way more than stock pads on a ZHP.

[prowlerflyer]

I second the above. Ceramics are purely just an adequate street pad, that is next to no dust. Cold performance is far worse than normal pads. I've run several brands on several of my cars. Akebonos work ok on my wife's XC90, but the recent Hawk PC pads I put on the ZHP are very unsatisfying, even just for street use. As much as I like clean wheels, I am ordering ST pads from Ray.

[JupiterBMW]

Hey Joop,

I'm actually pretty disappointed with the PQs, and am thinking of switching them out and putting the old OEM pads back in. Although the dust is VERY low compared to the stock pads, the stopping power is almost as proportionately low. They just don't have any bite, and you have to push the pedal quite hard to get a decent rate of braking. I drive pretty aggressively and have always love the BMW brakes - not so much right now.

If anyone has any recommendations for a low-dust pad with high initial bite and aggressive braking, I'd love to know.

I'll probably throw my barely used PQs up for sale shortly.
Hmm, good to know, thanks. I think I'll skip them...


Jon,
The dealer did a warranty brake job on the x5 at 34K miles. We drove it home & I pulled the factory pads to replace with ceramics to eliminate the dust. Installed Akebano ceramics and zero dust, same stopping power as the factory set up. But the harder ceramic pads chewed up the factory blank rotors, they only lasted less than 25K miles. Was past the factory warranty so called Ray for some S&D rotors plus bought another set of Akebano ceramics. Stopping power now better than the factory set up, zero dust, quite happy with this combo.
Bruce
Bruce, the brakes are different on the X5 and X5M... I checked the website for akebono and they don't have any applications for me. But, I am still on the lookout for a good, low dust pad...


As for the rest of you, regarding the ZHP, I loved the Stoptech pads on my ZHP. Dust wasn't horrible and performance was great... :)

[BCS_ZHP]

Hmm, good to know, thanks. I think I'll skip them...


Bruce, the brakes are different on the X5 and X5M... I checked the website for akebono and they don't have any applications for me. But, I am still on the lookout for a good, low dust pad...


As for the rest of you, regarding the ZHP, I loved the Stoptech pads on my ZHP. Dust wasn't horrible and performance was great... :)

Jon,
Ask Stuart what's on his x5M, he has HREs and I don't recall seeing dust.
Bruce

[JupiterBMW]

Jon,
Ask Stuart what's on his x5M, he has HREs and I don't recall seeing dust.
Bruce

Yeah, he said he has StopTech pads, but I haven't seen them listed on the website either. One of these days, I need to call StopTech and see what they say...

[Smilez]

I'm currently running ceramic pads because I wanted to see the brake dust difference compared to my stoptech. I'll take more brake dust over less initial bite any day. Hawks are pretty nice. They do now carry ceramic pads. Not sure how great their stopping power is.

[stephenkirsh]

Don't know what brand they are, as they came on the car when purchased, but my ceramic pads are great. I get ABS instantly at any speed I want. Granted, I'm on all season tires. I'll be putting the Arc-8s + better tires on soon and see if that's still the case.

[NoVAphotog]

I'm currently running ceramic pads because I wanted to see the brake dust difference compared to my stoptech. I'll take more brake dust over less initial bite any day. Hawks are pretty nice. They do now carry ceramic pads. Not sure how great their stopping power is.
+1

I've been happy with the ceramic posi-quiets I got from you Ray. I autocrossed with them and they seem to be great for daily use in Nova...maybe next go around I'll go with hawks or something (along with easier wheels to clean) to have a baseline to review more accurately bite wise. I do know that the oem pads on the back wheels are atrocious with the dust though...

[Smilez]

Yeah metallic pads just give off way too much brake dust.