Should I go to A/T

[ZHPESQ]

Just stumbled across an 06 Blk/Blk Coupe with 82,000 miles in mint, mint condition that dealer picked up yesterday. When I stopped by it wasnt even priced yet. He just called---asking $15,900.

Only problem is its an A/T...Grrrrrrrrr

Any auto drivers out there that like their auto. I am really struggling here.

[johnrando]

Mine is AT and it's fine. I made it a little more fun putting the paddle shift mod on and getting the Dinan STEP s/w (the difference is minor though). In manual mode, STEP doesn't shift as fast as I'd like, so you have to kind of change your shift points to get used to it, but you do figure it out. So it's good that you can shift, but don't have to.

It in no way replaces a manual though. I drove a late model Miata as a rental car and it's paddles shifted much quicker, the technology is just better today than back then.

I chose AT so that my wife could also drive my car, and for dealing with the LA traffic. I'm happy with my decision. However, all things being equal I'd rather drive a manual, and that's the best way to get all you can out of your ZHP.

The fact that you asked the question to me seems like you wouldn't be satisfied with AT and you'd kick yourself every time you got the car. Sounds to me like you should hold out for an MT. For me, I have no issues that I went with AT.

[Hermes]

I would probably take less for mine. Auto sucks, but at least it's steptronic and not traditional auto

[Pip]

Just stumbled across an 06 Blk/Blk Coupe with 82,000 miles in mint, mint condition that dealer picked up yesterday. When I stopped by it wasnt even priced yet. He just called---asking $15,900.

Only problem is its an A/T...Grrrrrrrrr

Any auto drivers out there that like their auto. I am really struggling here.

I really liked my auto while I had it, but I was always searching for a manual and decided I'd get an auto. I eventually started searching for a manual ZHP again. If you were stuck on manual get a manual. Autos are great especially with steptronic and the paddles for weekend drives, but it can't be something it isn't.

[stephenkirsh]

I autocross with my auto. Works fine for me. I'm just as fast as everybody else.

[Lanister]

Depends on the type of driving you do. Mine is AT and I really enjoy that I don't have to row through gears all day. Having driven stick for 15 years, I find that BMW AT is quite a step up from the traditional versions. There are times when I wish it was a manual but 80% of the time I'm happy it's not. As John pointed out, if you were set on a manual, hold out for one. ZHPs are not that rare.

[fredo]

+1. My e90 is auto and I enjoy it all day.

[Dave1027]

Of all the vehicles I have owned, it's been a half and half split between manuals and autos. Over the years I learned that some vehicles simply don't work well as manuals like tow vehicles. My current truck is an automatic and it works very well for it's intended tasks. All of the small light weight vehicles I have owned have been manuals and they worked well that way except for when AC was in use. It just made rowing through the gears a painful labor.

As far as reliablity goes, I have to admit all the autos I owned were trouble free. Most of the manuals had problems like clutch replacement, bad syncros, throwout bearing or full blown gear failure.

When I was test driving E46s I did try some sticks but they all felt to me like too much work. Just not enough low torque for the weight of the car. Maybe I got old and lazy but when I test drove my AT ZHP I thought it was really cool how it shifted like it had a shift kit in it and it just seemed effortless. I know for a fact there is no way I can shift as quickly or smoothly as the automatic does. I can honestly say, there is a four way stop on my way home from work where I thank myself daily for not holding out for a manual car.

The AT is a really nice unit that works well, imo. It's all down to personal preferance. To my fellow Step Brothers. We are not second class zhp owners. :)

[johnrando]

We definitely don't allow AT bashing (or any other bashing) here. That is just waaay too tired regardless of our policy.

[ELCID86]

Depends on the type of driving you do. Mine is AT and I really enjoy that I don't have to row through gears all day. Having driven stick for 15 years, I find that BMW AT is quite a step up from the traditional versions. There are times when I wish it was a manual but 80% of the time I'm happy it's not. As John pointed out, if you were set on a manual, hold out for one. ZHPs are not that rare.

+1. Depends on circumstances traffic, health, usage, etc). I like my AT, but do miss the MT from time to time...but not when sitting in traffic.






Thumbs, iPhone, Tapatalk.

[TigerTater]

I recently started driving my AT in step mode only and it has increased my satisfaction dramatically. I know feel more in control of the car and I'm seeing better mpg to boot!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Hermes]

+1. Depends on circumstances traffic, health, usage, etc). I like my AT, but do miss the MT from time to time...but not when sitting in traffic.






Thumbs, iPhone, Tapatalk.

This

[ZHPESQ]

I have been drive my MT sedan since I took delivery 11 years ago next month. I havent driven an AT in 13-14 years, but I do spend some time in Boston traffic which is a consideration.
I am going to take it for a ride and see how it feels.

[webster]

it's all about personal preference. i feel like if you really want a MT, and you settle for AT, you will regret it. if you're kinda on the fence and could go either way, as others have said the ZHP AT is good enough to where you probably won't miss the MT. for me personally, transmission option was not negotiable, it was manual or bust. again it all depends on the situation and how willing you are to be patient.

[ELCID86]

I have been drive my MT sedan since I took delivery 11 years ago next month. I havent driven an AT in 13-14 years, but I do spend some time in Boston traffic which is a consideration.
I am going to take it for a ride and see how it feels.
Great idea. I bet it's like this: :-D http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?12414-What-does-it-feel-like-to-drive-a-ZHP&p=340017#post340017 (#42)

+1 on Wes' points.

[Avetiso]

Don't settle.

[jakksfor20]

I've always had manuals in all my vehicles, but picking up this coupe ZHP has given me pause. I really like not having to work at driving so much. Since we consider my car (323ci) and the coupe the "fun" cars there are some days where I take the coupe just because I don't have to shift. Easier in traffic and if I know I am going to be on the phone, I drive it. I don't like ear Bluetooths.

[NorCal-Dimitri]

Don't settle.

+1000

[EDS]

Don't settle.

+1

You wouldn't settle on a woman...why settle on your ZHP?

[Mike2003ZHP]

I feel that if you going to for a ZHP, why not go all the way and get the 6MT. No disrespect of the AT owners but if you want a car that's easy in traffic then perhaps a non-ZHP 330 is a logical choice...and there are a lot of them out there for less $$ than the ZHP. An 330 with an AT is still a fantastic automobile. There are fewer and fewer low mileage MT's out there. I see this as a symptom of the car, MT drivers drive their cars more. An MT adds to the driving enjoyment.

[ken]

I just recently moved to AT after having my E36 M3 MT... I mainly moved because it is my DD and it gets old in traffic. I certainly miss MT, since it just isn't the same. Going into a curve, you just instinctively know what your intent is and where to position it going in, easing the clutch at the right time. Not the same as tapping it 3x to downshift, and then that lurch as it doesn't really ease and wean it into gear.

I don't regret it since the car's purpose is a DD, but it has had me think I maybe should get a track/fun car at some point. :)

Sent from my LG-VS980 using Tapatalk

[Dearg-due]

Just stumbled across an 06 Blk/Blk Coupe with 82,000 miles in mint, mint condition that dealer picked up yesterday. When I stopped by it wasnt even priced yet. He just called---asking $15,900.

Only problem is its an A/T...Grrrrrrrrr

Any auto drivers out there that like their auto. I am really struggling here.

I feel your pain. From the numbers that've been posted it seems like that it was 50/50 MT and AT with the ZHPs that were made (I can't remember exactly, but it was certainly a reasonable split), but from my searching online over the last 3 months, if MT's even make up 20% of the inventory available at any given point, I'd be gobsmacked (Frankly, most of the time it's probably between 5 and 10%). There have been times when I have searched Autotrader and not found 1 MT ZHP within 500 miles of my location.

It's to the point where I'm going a little squirrely ... researching what it would take to swap an AT for a 6 MT ... trying to figure out how to buy a car 2500+ miles away and have it shipped ...

Life ain't easy, it seems, when you just want to row some gears ...

[stephenkirsh]

I think ppl forget how fun the 3.64 diff is in the auto ;)

[Hermes]

I think ppl forget how fun the 3.64 diff is in the auto ;)

http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-21503-ring-pinion-gear-set-rp-only-410-e46-m3-e60-m5.aspx

or

http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-1565-ring-pinion-gear-set-rp-only-391-e46-m3-e60-m5-e63-m6.aspx

My preference...

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/12/a4y7e5ah.jpg

[ELCID86]

... trying to figure out how to buy a car 2500+ miles away and have it shipped ...


http://www.montway.com/

[stephenkirsh]

http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-21503-ring-pinion-gear-set-rp-only-410-e46-m3-e60-m5.aspx

or

http://www.turnermotorsport.com/p-1565-ring-pinion-gear-set-rp-only-391-e46-m3-e60-m5-e63-m6.aspx

My preference...

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/12/a4y7e5ah.jpg

Whoa that's cheap.

But has anybody done that mod?

[johnrando]

I feel that if you going to for a ZHP, why not go all the way and get the 6MT. No disrespect of the AT owners but if you want a car that's easy in traffic then perhaps a non-ZHP 330 is a logical choice...and there are a lot of them out there for less $$ than the ZHP. An 330 with an AT is still a fantastic automobile. There are fewer and fewer low mileage MT's out there. I see this as a symptom of the car, MT drivers drive their cars more. An MT adds to the driving enjoyment.

Seriously? :facepalm To me that comment is just so wrong on so many ways I can't even begin to list them.

[Pip]

Mike it's not all about easy in traffic it's about having a car that is easy in traffic and a fantastic weekend warrior with lovely looks. ZHP AT is perfect for that especially with the paddles.

[gmurphy]

Go with what ever you think you will like in the long run. When it comes down to it you are still going to be driving a not so special ZHP. They both have their perks and disadvantages. But if you come across a car that is everything you want then get it!


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

[derbo]

It really doesn't matter which one you get, its a ZHP no matter what :D

[ZHPESQ]

what some folks seem to be missing here is that I have been driving a 6MT ZHP sedan for nearly 11 years. I want to stay with a ZHP and truly love the BLK coupe.

[Dearg-due]

http://www.montway.com/

Oh, I know it can be shipped, that's just money, it's more the idea of buying a car I've never put my eyes on, and have driven, which is something more incalculable to me ...

[ELCID86]

Oh, I know it can be shipped, that's just money, it's more the idea of buying a car I've never put my eyes on, and have driven, which is something more incalculable to me ...

Understood. If no family members nearby, a good PPI can help calm the fears.


Thumbs, iPhone, Tapatalk.

[Hermes]

Whoa that's cheap.

But has anybody done that mod?

You also need a M3 rear end complete before you can change ring and pinion. It doesn't work with our stock diff. I will likely be going with M5 3.15 eventually

[Hornung418]

You also need a M3 rear end complete before you can change ring and pinion. It doesn't work with our stock diff. I will likely be going with M5 3.15 eventually

Same here. Currently watching a complete rear end on eBay...

Sent from my GS3.

[Hornung418]

And 6MT or bust.

Sent from my GS3.

[trancenation]

I have the A/T and it performs very well. Like some have mentioned, it depends on geographical region, traffic patterns, and your overall purpose of the car when it comes to choosing transmission type. For myself, I live in hilly San Francisco so it was best for me to get an A/T.

[Dearg-due]

I have the A/T and it performs very well. Like some have mentioned, it depends on geographical region, traffic patterns, and your overall purpose of the car when it comes to choosing transmission type. For myself, I live in hilly San Francisco so it was best for me to get an A/T.

Of course. I totally understand why some wise guys (and gals) choose an AT.

Me?

I live 12 miles from work, down a hilly, windy canyon road. Choosing a ZHP with an AT, for me, would be like choosing to marry a swimsuit model and only doing the hubba-hubba with a double-ply trashbag duct-taped over my ghoolies.

Of course, as I've stated, YMMV ...

[slater]

we definitely have two camps here; '6MT or bust' and 'AT makes a nice compromise'...

i do agree that the intended use of the car should make the choice. i also feel that after driving the ZHP with a 6MT - personally, i couldn't have one without. would i own an AT car in general? sure - but it would have to have really quick-shifting flappy-paddles. :)

i live out in the country, and don't commute - my wife actually drives more than i do. so for me the choice is obvious.

also.... and the married guys on here will love this (or hate it, LOL) - when my wife and i got married, she didn't know how to drive a manual - but she wanted to learn, because 'all of the cool girls can do it' - ha! so i taught her, and she has done wonderfully with it... and is now in the '6MT or bust' camp. ;) she actually would be upset if i bought a car with an AT...

peter

[stephenkirsh]

I think the steptronic is pretty good. Not quite dual clutch, but for something from 2003-2006, good. I don't think most of the "MT or bust" guys have driven a steptronic very much.

*awaits tomatoes*

[johnrando]

This should not be about our preference for MT or AT. We can provide our experience and/or impressions to help OP make his decision. I think there has been enough written so he can do that. As someone previously said, there are basically two camps. And to summarize further: OP has to make his choice; AT is "good enough" if there is no strong preference, but if there is an MT preference, it's better to go with that preference.

[Hermes]

I don't think most of the "MT or bust" guys have driven a steptronic very much.

I have for >5 years

[Dearg-due]

This should not be about our preference for MT or AT. We can provide our experience and/or impressions to help OP make his decision. I think there has been enough written so he can do that.

You, sir, are entirely too reasonable for these intertubes. I dock you "10 Troll Points" and ask that you vacate the space under your bridge of residence post haste!

[johnrando]

LOL. I shall vacate.

[Dearg-due]

:respect

[danewilson77]

This should not be about our preference for MT or AT. We can provide our experience and/or impressions to help OP make his decision. I think there has been enough written so he can do that. As someone previously said, there are basically two camps. And to summarize further: OP has to make his choice; AT is "good enough" if there is no strong preference, but if there is an MT preference, it's better to go with that preference.

Agree

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

[pilotnick1203]

Just stumbled across an 06 Blk/Blk Coupe with 82,000 miles in mint, mint condition that dealer picked up yesterday. When I stopped by it wasnt even priced yet. He just called---asking $15,900.

Only problem is its an A/T...Grrrrrrrrr

Any auto drivers out there that like their auto. I am really struggling here.
You know, I just bought a ZHP with an A/T and it is OK. A/T is great for Chillin, but I like the driver involvement option instead. My next ZHP will definitely be a Alpine coupe with 6spd.

[ELCID86]

You know, I just bought a ZHP with an A/T and it is OK. A/T is great for Chillin, but I like the driver involvement option instead. My next ZHP will definitely be a Alpine coupe with 6spd.

Good plan. Until then, try the paddle shifter wheel mod.

12857

[pilotnick1203]

How much is it?

[E_Rak]

Just stumbled across an 06 Blk/Blk Coupe with 82,000 miles in mint, mint condition that dealer picked up yesterday. When I stopped by it wasnt even priced yet. He just called---asking $15,900.

Only problem is its an A/T...Grrrrrrrrr

Any auto drivers out there that like their auto. I am really struggling here.

I haven't read through the thread but owning an auto, I can throw my $ 0.02 in. Don't do it. Just don't. If you want a manual, don't settle. The auto can be OK in certain situations, but it's never going to feel the same. For me, the torque converter ruins the experience. It is very eager to cut in even when probably not necessary. Maybe a ZHP with more power will be a better experience, but that's just what I see. I've not stopped looking at replacements since I bought the car almost three years ago.... Luckily the AWD and wagon bits make it beast in the winter, but a ZHP has neither of those qualities. Hold out for what you really want.

[ELCID86]

How much is it?

Hopefully Pip or Whitexi can help with the pricing/sourcing of the wheel and clock spring.

http://www.zhpmafia.com/forums/showthread.php?5067-SMG-steering-wheel-retrofitted-to-auto-E46-doityourself

[Dave1027]

Until then, try the paddle shifter wheel mod.

Yep, that makes the AT more fun. I think I'd be ok with mine if the + and - were reversed. I like the control the step gives me but it just seems backwards pushing forward to downshift. I think BMW made it that way to be like an SMG but it backwards from every other AT in the world.

[ELCID86]

Yep, that makes the AT more fun. I think I'd be ok with mine if the + and - were reversed. I like the control the step gives me but it just seems backwards pushing forward to downshift. I think BMW made it that way to be like an SMG but it backwards from every other AT in the world.

I agree on the backwards part. My wife's TSX is the opposite of the BMW sport shift pattern.

[johnrando]

How much is it?

Used M3 SMG Clock spring from $60 - $100. M3 SMG Steering wheel (with the paddle shifters) around $200? DIY wiring harness or buy someone's (rare) is just a few bucks.

[Vas]

I decided to contribute to this thread.

Currently I own 2 manual zhp sedans and my mother owns an auto zhp sedan. Since my car is in the shop, I have been using the auto zhp as a daily driver.

The auto is nice especially in step mode. It shifts well and and holds the rpm higher in the range which is great. No complaints from me and I do enjoy it. However a part of me is missing that 3rd pedal.

Not sure how else to put it but a ZHP is a nice car no matter what. However to me personally it feels more proper with a manual gearbox.

But as others have said, don't settle if it just does not feel right. If your mind is set on a manual, keep looking. But either way you whatever you get, you will enjoy it.

[jiggz]

If you want a manual, do not settle for an Auto. There are tons of ZHPs out there to choose from…maybe not today, but they continually pop up.

I had a manual E46 325i for 7 years, and now drive an Auto ZHP. Sure the ZHP is still quicker & faster, but not a day goes by I don't wish my ZHP had a 6MT. I didn't settle either…I just needed a car my wife could drive, otherwise I'd still be driving that manual 325i. So much fun compared to an automatic..

[BRGcoopahS]

It's been said before but it's what I'd also say. If you really prefer a manual (which it seems you do), then don't get an auto.

If you can deal with a manual in heavy traffic just fine, then you don't need an auto. That's exactly how I am.

[ZHPESQ]

Here is the car that I was speaking of.
Interestingly, miles increased by 5,000 and price increased by a $1,000 after I spoke with him.
I think its too high for an AT

http://www.centralmotorsales.com/detail-2006-bmw-3_series-330ci-used-11854729.html

[Pip]

I agree on the backwards part. My wife's TSX is the opposite of the BMW sport shift pattern.

You guys on the backwards train are crazy. I think others are backwards and BMW got it right. My opinion is that when I upshift I'm pushing myself into the seat so pull back. Downshift - I'm usually braking so push forward. I guess it is a matter of preference. If you really wanted to switch it up you just need to buy a face plate prior to '03 or something and then switch the wires.

[Pip]

Here is the car that I was speaking of.
Interestingly, miles increased by 5,000 and price increased by a $1,000 after I spoke with him.
I think its too high for an AT

http://www.centralmotorsales.com/detail-2006-bmw-3_series-330ci-used-11854729.html

Too expensive. I sold my '05 with 89k for 12,250 and it had all records and maintenance. It wasn't in the best cosmetic condition with a-pillars, road rash from highway on lower valence and a scuff on the rear door handle, but $16k for '06 auto seems like crazy talk.

[Dave1027]

You guys on the backwards train are crazy. I think others are backwards and BMW got it right. My opinion is that when I upshift I'm pushing myself into the seat so pull back. Downshift - I'm usually braking so push forward. I guess it is a matter of preference. If you really wanted to switch it up you just need to buy a face plate prior to '03 or something and then switch the wires.

Hey Sean, I'll probably pick your brain when I get ready to switch mine.

It's just that every AT vehicle (other than this zhp), it's been pull back to down shift. Even now, I have to think about it before I throw the shifter. I don't want to have to think about it. I usually downshift instinctively when I need right now acceleration.

[Pip]

Hey Sean, I'll probably pick your brain when I get ready to switch mine.

It's just that every AT vehicle (other than this zhp), it's been pull back to down shift. Even now, I have to think about it before I throw the shifter. I don't want to have to think about it. I usually downshift instinctively when I need right now acceleration.

Anytime.

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=760259

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/14/03/25/8epemaha.jpg

[terraphantm]

If you want a manual, do not settle for an Auto. There are tons of ZHPs out there to choose from…maybe not today, but they continually pop up.

I had a manual E46 325i for 7 years, and now drive an Auto ZHP. Sure the ZHP is still quicker & faster, but not a day goes by I don't wish my ZHP had a 6MT. I didn't settle either…I just needed a car my wife could drive, otherwise I'd still be driving that manual 325i. So much fun compared to an automatic..

This. If I bought an auto, it would only be if the price was low enough to justify swapping in a manual

[Dave1027]

Anytime.

http://forum.e46fanatics.com/showthread.php?t=760259


Thanks for that link. I finished the switch yesterday. It's works perfectly. Only thing left to do now is find a selector indicator from a <2002 E46 steptronic. One with the "+" forward. That's really not much of a biggie to me though.

BTW, this was the first time I had ever disconnected the battery. It did not occur to me until I had opened and closed the door that I may have done something wrong. Because I have a coupe, whenever I open the doors the windows drop down a little automatically and then go back up closed. Disconnecting the battery killed that function. Should I have opened the doors before disconnecting the battery? It all worked out any way. I did not break the window, luckily.

[ELCID86]

I think the coupe auto window lowering is more for ease of closing (reduced air pressure). I wish the sedans had it.

Several users here here frequent junk yards, etc. post a WTB thread or in the pay-it-forward thread.


Thumbs, iPhone, Tapatalk.

[ranger]

I enjoyed my 2005 Alpine White 6MT ZHP coupe but I do not miss the manual with the C55 I am driving now. I have paddle shifters in the C55 but very seldom use them. I guess I am getting old plus it is so much easier (in my humble opinion) to drive in Atlanta traffic with the auto.

[Simmsled]

When I'm on an entertaining/windy/hilly back road, I'm not really changing gears all that much.
What I am doing is enjoying the thrill of adjusting my steering and throttle inputs to carve the line I want. This car, be it in stick or step, will satisfy on these points. I have a stick and a step ZHP, and don't feel like either make this car 'better', just simply different.
If I lived where the roads resembled something like Deals Gap, I would likely just go for the stick. Since I live in the real world, with stop and go traffic, a wife that can drive a stick but lacks confidence, etc. the step is a welcome companion.

http://grapplergourmet.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Candy-bars.jpg

[goodoo]

Mine is AT and it's fine. I made it a little more fun putting the paddle shift mod on and getting the Dinan STEP s/w (the difference is minor though). In manual mode, STEP doesn't shift as fast as I'd like, so you have to kind of change your shift points to get used to it, but you do figure it out. So it's good that you can shift, but don't have to.

It in no way replaces a manual though. I drove a late model Miata as a rental car and it's paddles shifted much quicker, the technology is just better today than back then.

I chose AT so that my wife could also drive my car, and for dealing with the LA traffic. I'm happy with my decision. However, all things being equal I'd rather drive a manual, and that's the best way to get all you can out of your ZHP.

The fact that you asked the question to me seems like you wouldn't be satisfied with AT and you'd kick yourself every time you got the car. Sounds to me like you should hold out for an MT. For me, I have no issues that I went with AT.

I was in the same predicament as you. I wanted the wife to be able to drive the car as well... but when it came down to making the decision between auto and manual. I chose manual. I made the wife learn to drive six speed. HAH