View Full Version : Finally ready to buy another BMW
Got rid of my Mercedes yesterday, and now the hunt begins. I've been searching for a local~ish ZHP for the last couple months and have given up on finding anything clean, so Im now looking into the E90. Specifically the 330i and 335i, and preferably manual.
Looks like there's about $4-5k difference between the models (locally) of comparable mileage/features. The extra power of the 335i would be sweet, but I'm not sure it's worth the extra $5k and higher maintenance/worse reliability.
What would you do? (Let's assume these two cars are the only options.)
BimmerWill
06-25-2013, 07:52 AM
Personally I would opt for the 335...easily can get more power out of it if you feel the need. If you wanted to do the same with the 330i you'd be shelling out close to that 5k just to put you up to where the 335 is stock maybe a little more. I'm not real familiar with what performance options are available for the newer models. Either way I think you would be happier with the 335...may be a little more of a drama queen but I'm guessing you're used to maintenance and DIY so no biggie.
Now just need to decide on N54 or N55 lol
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Torxuvin
06-25-2013, 08:49 AM
335. May as well if you are going with an e90. Lots of easy power. Should be a newer car. (If you need to get a loan, it can help you find a lower interest rate)
The 330 I was thinking of is no go. The dealer wants too much for it (18.2 + tax), considering there are 335's for low 20's.
What are the main pros/cons of N54 vs N55? I'm at work, so gotta keep car-related googling down :)
Ah, looks like the N55 debuted in '09 cars - those are a bit out of my price range. Don't want to get a loan for this car, so if I get a 335, it'll be an '07, or maaaybe an '08.
Avetiso
06-25-2013, 12:05 PM
335i
BimmerWill
06-25-2013, 01:01 PM
From what I've gathered the N55 is an updated version of the N54. There are subtle differences between the two but the biggest one people talk about is in regards to moving from a twin turbo (N54) to a twin scroll (N55) which is said to help alleviate more boost lag and make power at the lower end of the tach as well as the higher end achieving best of both worlds.
From a tuning standpoint the N54 has a much better market at this point due to it being an older generation and seems to handle it very well. It is not unheard of to achieve 405 to the wheels in these cars with some pretty simple bolt ons and a tune.
The problem the N55 seems to be having is that where it is newer not too many companies have been able to crack it open yet in order to achieve the same kind of power gains. This may change in the coming months to years but at this point N54 seems to be the way to go.
Additionally with the somewhat unique manifold and turbo setup of the N55 should you later choose to upgrade it will be a little more difficult to find a good setup without spending some decent cash.
Bottom line they are both solid motors and have both one motor of the year (N54 for a number of straight years) so you can't really go wrong. The majority of the decision comes down to personal preference and what you plan to do with the car.
If you do rhd up getting an N54 make sure the HPF has been replaced on it. I'm not sure if the N55 has had as much problems but the N54's were plagued with failing fuel pumps until they got them sorted out.
I'm sure someone with more knowledge than I can give you more information should you feel so inclined to inquire further about the two motors and their differences.
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I'd avoid 07's like the plague due their first gen nature, stick with 08+. Both the N54/N55's are known to have the HPFP issue, but BMW has extended coverage for the part, so I wouldn't let that be a huge deterrence. N55 has two-fewer CAT's to deal with, lesser turbo-lag, only one turbo to replace instead of two... N55 if you can swing it is my vote. If not, the N54 still has tons of support. You'll enjoy either engine as it comes to performance.
Thanks for the info, guys. I'm very aware of the HPFP issues (and a neighbour of mine recently got introduced to the problem the hard way), but I'm not too worries about it since the warranty coverage for it is pretty good.
Not much choices around here, and I can't be without a car for too long. There's an '07 335xi with 35k miles for sale for a decent price - unfortunately it's auto. I think I will still check it out though.
HokieZHP
06-25-2013, 03:37 PM
I just got a 2007 335i coupe and love it. The extra power is nice to have and there's nothing better than punching it in 2nd and hearing the turbos spool up before you get thrown back into your seat! I was lucky enough to find a low mileage one (30k) that had the HPFP replaced and I just had the turbos replaced. No other issues so far after 2k miles.
johnrando
06-25-2013, 06:17 PM
Go back to the zhp. Patience. :) If E90, I don't know enough about them to comment.
Ugh... there is nothing decent local. ZHP/E90/E53/etc - nothing. I've even gone as far as to look into A4/A3/GTI and a few mazdas... :(
This is the only semi-decent local option: http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/van/cto/3843655986.html
100km (60miles) on the car, and seller won't be back in town until next Tuesday, which is a pain for me :/
HokieZHP
06-25-2013, 06:52 PM
I was looking at GTI's as well as A4's when I was shopping for a new car. I just couldn't deal with FWD in the GTI and I'm not a fan of the A4's.
One will show up. I couldn't find an e92 anywhere near me that fit my specifications and then suddenly the perfect one popped up not even 30 miles from me!
Avetiso
06-25-2013, 07:39 PM
Looks like a nice car.
About the ad: I don't get the whole "serious inquiries only" and barely having info about the car. Not even mileage?
Looks like a nice car.
About the ad: I don't get the whole "serious inquiries only" and barely having info about the car. Not even mileage?
Drive me nuts, too.
I just found this one: http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/van/ctd/3861703874.html
Looks like a winner, and I think I'm willing to settle for the coupe. Going to check it out tomorrow (I'm sure I'll love it), and am thinking about offering $24k out the door (we have 12% sales tax). Thoughts on the price?
// edit - scratch that.
Just spoke to my buddy, and this is his old car, that he totalled. Then this is a rebuild :/
Mustang GT was my primary BMW competitor, but I just couldn't get over the cheap interior. Hell of a car though with the 5.0.
ELCID86
06-26-2013, 01:17 PM
Not a fan of mustangs...
+1
Shawn in VA.
Via thumbs and Tapatalk.
Can I ask why you aren't considering E46 M3? Need 4 doors?
HokieZHP
06-26-2013, 06:26 PM
I was looking at the e46m instead of my e92 but the insurance and parts cost deterred it for me.
Can I ask why you aren't considering E46 M3? Need 4 doors?
Four doors is a big plus for me, yes. But the main reason is that any reasonably clean E46 M3 is getting listed for more than 335's (at least locally). Owning an ///M does appeal to me, but let's face it, the 335 has better features, interior, is way easier to make way faster, cheaper on insurance and parts, and will be easier to resell when the time comes. It just makes sense.
--
What do you guys think of this one? http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/rch/ctd/3813673180.html
It's an auto, but I think I'm willing to accept that, given how well equipped it is. Nice colour combo, too.
Torxuvin
06-27-2013, 04:31 AM
Four doors is a big plus for me, yes. But the main reason is that any reasonably clean E46 M3 is getting listed for more than 335's (at least locally). Owning an ///M does appeal to me, but let's face it, the 335 has better features, interior, is way easier to make way faster, cheaper on insurance and parts, and will be easier to resell when the time comes. It just makes sense.
--
What do you guys think of this one? http://vancouver.en.craigslist.ca/rch/ctd/3813673180.html
It's an auto, but I think I'm willing to accept that, given how well equipped it is. Nice colour combo, too.
Good color combo. Still, I don't know if I could sacrifice the transmission.
I'm not doubting you guys, but I would have never thought the E46 M3 would have higher insurance than a much newer car, how much was the difference?
I know E46 M3 parts can be easily 2-3x the cost of our E46 parts, but aren't the E90 a lot harder to DIY? Are E90 part costs close to E46 part costs? (This would also surprises me!)
Torxuvin
06-27-2013, 11:42 AM
I'm not doubting you guys, but I would have never thought the E46 M3 would have higher insurance than a much newer car, how much was the difference?
I know E46 M3 parts can be easily 2-3x the cost of our E46 parts, but aren't the E90 a lot harder to DIY? Are E90 part costs close to E46 part costs? (This would also surprises me!)
Not sure about a newer car, but I pay 119/month for full coverage on both the Corvette and ZHP. The M3 was 113/month by itself
Not sure about a newer car, but I pay 119/month for full coverage on both the Corvette and ZHP. The M3 was 113/month by itself
Wow that is crazy! Maybe Charlie will chime in, I think he was the one with both a ZHP and M3.
Avetiso
06-27-2013, 11:58 AM
If you're a fan of manual, it's manual or bust, IMO. Don't want to rush into something you'll regret. That other white coupe; I could tell it was rebuilt just by looking at it, lol.
BimmerWill
06-27-2013, 12:01 PM
Not sure about a newer car, but I pay 119/month for full coverage on both the Corvette and ZHP. The M3 was 113/month by itself
How old are you though? That seems to be a pretty major factor most of the time.
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Torxuvin
06-27-2013, 12:44 PM
How old are you though? That seems to be a pretty major factor most of the time.
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My Breakdown: Full coverage for each (Geico)
23-24 with the m3 (113/month)
24 vette (80/month)
24 both vette and zhp (127/month)
25 now w/both (119/month)
Clean record. No tickets/accidents/etc
Ironically before then I had a 2003 eclipse gts. It was 80/month liability on my mom's plan with Allstate. As much as full coverage by myself on the corvette.
Moral of the story: You should just buy a corvette Kerunt. ;) (And sorry for the OT)
Barefoot-ZHP
06-27-2013, 01:20 PM
E90 parts are more expensive and stupid crap breaks compared to the ZHP.
I traded my 06 ZHP in on an 08 335i sedan with 26k on it. Yeah, the turbos are addicting but I miss my e46 just due to the stupid stuff with this car!!!
The HPFP has already been replaced. I have replaced the water pump and battery cable under warranty, now the transmission is giving me issues, first auto I have had in 20+ years and already regret it. The e90 auto's are not reliable at all, new trannie at 36k?!!
The inside door handles are melting, will be replacing them next at $58 a door, stealer wanted $124/door plus labor. NAV has issues occasionally.
Car now has 36k on it and I need to figure in Brakes, Front Control arms, plugs and maybe an injector or two before 45k. May have to spring for a walnut cleaning around then too. Turbos are fun for get up and go, but they are like dating really hot chicks, just more maintenance than they are worth in my opinion.
Good color combo. Still, I don't know if I could sacrifice the transmission.
Called about the car, was told its being used and isn't available until a month from now. Bizarre. Especially since they re-listed the car in a new ad today.
Hate to imply racism, but the only thing I can think of is that they don't want to sell to me since I'm not Chinese. Dealership is in a very Chinese neighbourhood, where many stores don't even have English signs. Weird.
danewilson77
06-27-2013, 01:57 PM
Or.....they are letting someone use the car for a month.
Then why list it for sale today?
danewilson77
06-27-2013, 02:15 PM
Then why list it for sale today?
Maybe they're just not good business people. Maybe something came up last minute. I wouldn't jump to racism though.
Maybe they're just not good business people. Maybe something came up last minute. I wouldn't jump to racism though.
Yeah, possible. I guess I just didn't like the way she brushed me off over the phone - no "come take a look when it's back," no nothing, just get off the phone and hang up kind of feel to it.
danewilson77
06-27-2013, 02:19 PM
Yeah, possible. I guess I just didn't like the way she brushed me off over the phone - no "come take a look when it's back," no nothing, just get off the phone and hang up kind of feel to it.
Yeah...I hear ya. There could be some of "that" involved, and I'm sorry this happened. I would just check back periodically, if you even want to deal with them.
I don't think I've ever been this frustrated looking for a car. There is simply nothing out here. Ugh...
danewilson77
06-27-2013, 05:51 PM
Yeah... It's tough being up there. Is there anyway to buy in the US?
HTC DNA ON TT4 BETA, WILLIAMSBURG, VA
Yeah... It's tough being up there. Is there anyway to buy in the US?
HTC DNA ON TT4 BETA, WILLIAMSBURG, VA
Yup, I'm checking nearby US-side CL, too. So far I haven't seen anything that would make me want to jump on it and deal with the extra headache.
Every decent-looking car turns out to be a rebuild (salvage)... after 20 emails back and fourth. Half my attempts at contact don't get responses. Tried to see a local car and the buyer keeps pushing back to "tomorrow," etc, etc. Always something. And just about every car advertised as mint has had bodywork done, or has scratches and dents all over. Such an insane waste of time and effort.
I did find a clean, low-mileage '03 M3 coupe reasonably close (Vancouver island) for a very reasonable price. Unfortunately it's an SMG transmission :(.
ranger
06-28-2013, 04:15 AM
Look at the "Lemon Law Buyback" cars. Check out Donohoo Auto just for an example. When my ZHP was totaled - I almost pulled the trigger on a "buy back" 335 through Donohoo. I have a different outlook on my cars as I commute 70 miles a day in Atlanta traffic - no use in getting a pristine car as it will get wrecked eventually in traffic, in the parking lots, etc (case in point the rear ended ZHP). The ONLY reason I did not get the "buyback" 335 was I found a really clean MB C55 AMG for a smoking deal.
I have never owned a M3 and was looking at those too. In the Atlanta GA area, the M3s that were worth having were either not for sale or priced very high. All I could find were WELL WORN cars that needed a lot of TLC ($$$) and were SMGs. If you want a SMG Convertible M3, look in Atlanta.
I helped my daughter buy a used 2006 BMW 325i - it is not as reliable as my 2005 325i or my 2005 ZHP (she had to have it.....so pretty).
When the C55 needs replacing, I pray I can find a clean ZHP again.
onepercent
06-28-2013, 07:24 AM
Wow that is crazy! Maybe Charlie will chime in, I think he was the one with both a ZHP and M3.
I just went from an 04 ZHP coupe to an 04 M3 Vert.
I'm 32 years old, male, perfect driving record, and live in a very low/zero-theft area.
ZHP insurance was about $500/yr, M3 insurance is about $650/yr. When I was looking at getting a M3 coupe, I believe the insurance on the vert was about $50-100/yr more. So for me, insurance on the M3 coupe was barely more than that for the ZHP.
... And that BMW which is "not available for a month" was just re-listed on Craigslist. Yeah...
danewilson77
06-28-2013, 08:17 AM
... And that BMW which is "not available for a month" was just re-listed on Craigslist. Yeah...
Call them back. Ask them what the deal is.
Call them back. Ask them what the deal is.
"We deleted the ad, I don't know what you're seeing."
danewilson77
06-28-2013, 08:54 AM
LOL.
I would pass. They obviously don't want to sell the car.
I think a seller reserves the right to sell their property to who they want (Not well versed in the law though).
I'm not saying I agree with it, and it bothers me as well, but it is, what it is.
cakM3
06-28-2013, 09:14 AM
Wow that is crazy! Maybe Charlie will chime in, I think he was the one with both a ZHP and M3.
I shell out about $1400/yr for both the ///M and ZHP (full coverage insurance w/ a $250 deductable). I'm at work at the moment so when I get home I'll dig up the specifics of how much the ///M runs but I can say it's worth it for me to have both of these cars. Since getting my ZHP, I pretty much put less than 5k miles/yr on the ///M and do pretty much all the driving with my ZHP. So far this year, I have only put on 1,400 miles on the ///M and that was for the 2013 reunion meet at Dane's.
Not sure if I'm answering any questions here....just catching up since my name was brought into this thread :thumbsup
Avetiso
06-28-2013, 09:32 AM
LOL.
I would pass. They obviously don't want to sell the car.
I think a seller reserves the right to sell their property to who they want (Not well versed in the law though).
I'm not saying I agree with it, and it bothers me as well, but it is, what it is.
Maybe it's not so in Canada? :dunno
LOL.
I would pass. They obviously don't want to sell the car.
I think a seller reserves the right to sell their property to who they want (Not well versed in the law though).
I'm not saying I agree with it, and it bothers me as well, but it is, what it is.
Yup, not the end of the world. And I've no idea re: the legalities here. I do know we don't have official "lemon laws" though.
webster
06-28-2013, 10:58 AM
why don't you expand your search to other parts of the country? you could potentially fly down and drive a car home, or have it shipped. it might add some extra expense to your budget, but if you're already considering a price range in the low $20k's, it's definitely doable. lots of awesome ZHPs/E90s in Cali, for instance.
why don't you expand your search to other parts of the country? you could potentially fly down and drive a car home, or have it shipped. it might add some extra expense to your budget, but if you're already considering a price range in the low $20k's, it's definitely doable. lots of awesome ZHPs/E90s in Cali, for instance.
Importing vehicles from far away is a hassle, and so far I haven't seen any prices which would make it worth it. Cars from East of the Rockies are out of the question due to salt/corrosion issues. I haven't checked Cali for 335's though. Might have to go that route.
Taking a look at an '03 M3 tomorrow. From the ad it sounds very clean.
Car looked nice, made a deal, did a PPI, turns out it needs $2k of work. Ugh.
At this rate, pretty soon I'll buy a civic and call it quits. :(
Car looked nice, made a deal, did a PPI, turns out it needs $2k of work. Ugh.
$2k of work for serious issues? To get it caught up with maintenance that doesn't sound that bad, we are talking about a 10 year old performance car. You will be hard pressed to find a car with all maintenance up to date unless it's an enthusiast's car, if so expect to pay a premium.
$2k of work for serious issues? To get it caught up with maintenance that doesn't sound that bad, we are talking about a 10 year old performance car. You will be hard pressed to find a car with all maintenance up to date unless it's an enthusiast's car, if so expect to pay a premium.
Oil leaking from the pan.
Battery warning light coming on - alternator has hammer marks on it and needs to be replaced.
Tons of error codes. VANOS errors. Errors reporting mis-fire on each cylinder. Likely all related to the poor alternator and low voltage it's putting out.
Tires are gone.
Brake pads are some cheap no-name crap.
Aftermarket headers and no cat - raspy noise when accelerating.
Rear shock mounts and shocks need replacement.
Advertised as no accident, but rear quarter panels and bumper have been painted.
One of the bi-xenon headlight bulbs is going out and needs replacement (ie. paying for both).
Lots more work than regular maintenance. For one of the highest-priced and lowest-mileage local M3s, I expected better. My ZHP was in 10x better condition at twice the mileage. Wish I never sold it.
danewilson77
06-29-2013, 07:11 PM
Wish I never sold it.
If I had a nickel for every time.....
HTC DNA, Williamsburg, VA
Oil leaking from the pan.
Battery warning light coming on - alternator has hammer marks on it and needs to be replaced.
Tons of error codes. VANOS errors. Errors reporting mis-fire on each cylinder. Likely all related to the poor alternator and low voltage it's putting out.
Tires are gone.
Brake pads are some cheap no-name crap.
Aftermarket headers and no cat - raspy noise when accelerating.
Rear shock mounts and shocks need replacement.
Advertised as no accident, but rear quarter panels and bumper have been painted.
One of the bi-xenon headlight bulbs is going out and needs replacement (ie. paying for both).
Lots more work than regular maintenance. For one of the highest-priced and lowest-mileage local M3s, I expected better. My ZHP was in 10x better condition at twice the mileage. Wish I never sold it.
Ya I would walk away from that too!
Avetiso
06-29-2013, 07:26 PM
Would you have purchased if you could haggle the price considering those faults?
Would you have purchased if you could haggle the price considering those faults?
If he'd dropped $2k in price, yes, I would have taken the car and gotten it fixed up. I had the bank draft in my pocket and ready to go. I offered that to him - he refused. He suggested the same price, but his own mechanic (the one that ok'ed this car to begin with) would have replaced the oil pan gasket and alternator (with god knows what) - not going to fly.
I've been checking CL all evening - the dealer updated all of their ads and brought the price up on this car by $2k (to their original asking price of $24888). This morning they had this car listed at $22888, and I had negotiated it down to $23k out the door (including 12% taxes, fees, etc.) before I did the PPI on it.
I shell out about $1400/yr for both the ///M and ZHP (full coverage insurance w/ a $250 deductable). I'm at work at the moment so when I get home I'll dig up the specifics of how much the ///M runs but I can say it's worth it for me to have both of these cars. Since getting my ZHP, I pretty much put less than 5k miles/yr on the ///M and do pretty much all the driving with my ZHP. So far this year, I have only put on 1,400 miles on the ///M and that was for the 2013 reunion meet at Dane's.
Not sure if I'm answering any questions here....just catching up since my name was brought into this thread :thumbsup
$1400/yr so about $117/month. I guess I was just wondering if both cars are covered the same (which it seems like they are), how much of that is the ZHP and how much is the M3? With so many variables for car insurance, the same driver insuring ZHP & M3 would give me a better idea of the insurance difference.
Somewhat unrelated but I'm currently paying $147/month or $1764/yr for the wife and I to insure both the ZHP and her 2012 Mazda 3. The Mazda 3 is $81/month and the ZHP is $65/month for identical insurance.
Thanks!
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